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01-31-2006, 03:03 PM
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Political Junkie
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 255
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by frank12
No way is a defintition of torture just going to be if you are physically injured. Torture can include a lot of activities that leave no scars and not even any bruises if you know the right places to target. And then how about the all too fun method of electricty and water applied to the correct parts of your anatomy - now there's no way you can really say that isn't torture to have some guy electrocute your "equipment" (trying to be nice in case there are ladies in the house) repeatedly until you say whatever it is they want you to say to get them to stop.
OK, let's agree that Saddam Hussein may have been a little more blunt in his actions, but you wanna know who taught him how to use a shredder and who gave him those shredders that would be capable of shredding a person (got to be wood chippers though I would think) - WE DID! Yes, indeed, way back in the 1980s, we were best buddies with Saddam and we supplied and trained his army in how to beat the Iranians (who strangly now we're kind of friendly with again ....) and torture captured soldiers for info ... as we've down time and time again all over the world.
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OK, let's agree that we are the cause of Saddam. It was all our fault. If true, isn't it time we had a decent President to correct the situation? You people really need to get a life.
Last edited by a25052; 01-31-2006 at 03:05 PM.
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01-31-2006, 03:10 PM
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Political Junkie
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 255
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ididnotvote4him
I agree with John McCains assessment of torture.
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Do you also aree with his view that in certain circumstances you have to do what you have to do? |
04-09-2006, 03:03 AM
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Political Novice
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 9
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Those who "decry" so-called torture obviously believe in the philosophy of turning the other cheek. The problem is that when you turn the other cheek to vicious Islamo-fascists you may very well have your throat cut.
The left wingers who moan and groan about our vicious torturers and our outsourcing of torture obviously are just trying to score political points. The court martials of those responsible at Abu Ghirab are more court martials than the Islamo-fascists have held for their brutal beheadings of innocent Westerners.
The moralists who call us depraved when torture like "waterboarding" is applied, obviously do not remember of did not see innocent American citizens, our countrymen, hurling themselves from the top of the World Trade Center to escape being burned alive.
The killers were Islamo-Fascists. Any American who is a patriot demands that the Islamo-fascists be brought to account.
Anything else is craven cowardice.
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04-09-2006, 03:45 PM
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Political Mastermind
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Northern California
Posts: 1,408
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What constitutes torture?
To me torture is having to listen to protein deficient lefties whine all the time about the stupidest things.
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04-24-2006, 08:39 AM
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Political Novice
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 5
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you know whats beautiful about the terroist their not protected by any laws so it really dosent matter what we do to them until someone says its illegal then its all good i personally think they should all be killed without exeption. genva convention uniformed soldiers of a nation not ununiformed civilan coimbants trying to kill my people
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04-24-2006, 11:17 AM
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Political Junkie
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 126
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lord Bobington The Third
Yeah, and that makes us worse than the terrorists. Riiiggghht. We're not the ones who go into the middle of crowds of children and blow ourselves up to kill as many of them as possible. And aren't you from the same side that is constantly complaining about how we need to turn more things over to the Iraqis? Guess you got what you wanted, huh? If we give them control of things, we aren't going to get to run them the way we want to.
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so that makes it ok?
so the end justifies the means? In fact that could be the motto of this entire war.....
the end (attacking Iraq) justifies the means (the lies to get us there) |
04-24-2006, 11:21 AM
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Political Junkie
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 126
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by veryvegan
We're supposed to be better than them, and if we can't bring ourselves to treat other people humanely, then we don't need to cloak our actions in all this B.S. about how we're there for humanitarian goals.
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yup, I cant figure out why they hate us so much! |
04-24-2006, 11:40 AM
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Political Junkie
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 126
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04-24-2006, 12:15 PM
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Political Mastermind
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Michigan
Posts: 2,429
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Is it permissible for the insurgents to use the same tactics on your son to get information? Didn't think so. Just because it isn't the worst thing you've ever heard of does not justify it.
The Bottom Line here is this. We are a nation governed by it's people and ruled by law that we have put forth. Our rule of law should precede any other impulse no matter what country we are in and no matter what the situation is. THAT is what makes this nation great.
If you can't use these "techniques" on the "urban terrorists" in our own cities, then they should not be employed anywhere at anytime by the United States of America nor any of it's allies in wartime. Especially if that war was started by us and is being conducted by us.
You are also making a big leap of faith in assuming that everyone suffering these "techniques" has information or is anything other than completely innocent. Surely there have been many innocents that have gone through this process. Seeing as we are just barely treading water in Iraq, I can't see where a whole lot of useful info is being generated.
I also think it's facile to compare anything we do to terrorists. It's like comparing apples to celery root. We are a nation of laws morals and values. They are a loose band of fundamentalist extremists. Torture from their side begins and happens at the lowest levels, torture at our end begins at the highest.
Please stop arguing about semantics. If it's not allowed here to get info to stop terrorists at home, if it's not allowed to stop organized crime, it it's not used here to end gang violence, then we don't need it as a tool against insurgents.
Please stop (not necessarily in this thread) making comparisons between the USA and nazi's, terrorists, fascists, etc. it really does nothing but sends a red flag to the opposing side that an "EXTREME VIEW" is here for you to make "EXTREME ATTACKS" against. Most of the issues here are worth talking about, but we should be working to find common ground, not going after each other like starving dogs.
Besides, we are better than them. WAAAaaayyyy off track at the moment, but we have the tools available to us come together as a country and resume our position as the "Leaders of the Free World". United We Stand, remember that? Divided we WILL fall! It's not just a catchy saying, it's age old wisdom.
As long as everyone is bent on taking extreme views on everything, we will remain divided. It is this division that is helping the terrorists more than anything else. The people have lost control of their government because we are too busy fighting pointless arguments about the definition of torture. Get to the source of the problems! Look for the common denominators.
Solve the core problems and the rest of it begins to fade away.
__________________
S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall
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