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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 02:49 PM
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I'm not aware of these innocent women and children that have been killed.
Of course they are.....by members of their own cult.
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Old 04-07-2008, 02:49 PM
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In fascist states the media and government work in cooperation with each other. Both were complicit in the original WMD war crime that got us in there and both are looking to clog up the issue with irrelevant fluff in order to divert the real issue.

'We know where the weapons of mass destruction are and we will find them"...
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Old 04-07-2008, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Commissioner View Post
Who's a bigger liar? McCain or democrats?

From Annenberg Fact Check:

It should be noted that both Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama, despite their frequent talk of withdrawing from Iraq, have said repeatedly that they would maintain at least some troops in a combat role in Iraq for some time, possibly their entire term of office.


There's little doubt that McCain is less eager than either Clinton or Obama to bring troops home without further suppression of insurgent attacks. But it's a rank falsehood for the DNC to accuse McCain of wanting to wage "endless war" based on his support for a presence in Iraq something like the U.S. role in South Korea.
YOu are correct about the Dems in this case, and it obscures the real issue of more of the same if McCain is elected, but that a person of the right should accuse ANYONE of a rank falsehood after 5+years of rankness and falsehoods may be the new definition of chutzpah.

=========================================

In Mr. Bush’s telling, Basra was a “defining moment in the history of a free Iraq.” He praised the Iraqi prime minister, Nuri al-Maliki, and boasted repeatedly that the Iraqi forces were fighting “in the lead.” The Pentagon spokesman declared that this splendid engagement was “a byproduct of the success of the surge.”

It was a defining moment all right. Mr. Maliki’s impulsive and ill-planned attempt to vanquish the militias in southern Iraq loyal to his Shiite rival, the cleric Moktada al-Sadr, was a failure that left Mr. Sadr more secure than before. Though some Iraqi armed forces were briefly in the lead, others mutinied. Eventually American and British forces and air power had to ride to the rescue in both Basra and Baghdad. Even then, the result was at best a standoff, with huge casualties. The battle ended only when Mr. Maliki’s own political minions sought a cease-fire.

Mr. McCain was just as wrong about Basra as he was in 2003, when he said the war would be “brief” and be paid for by Iraqi oil revenues. Or as he was in the 1990s, when he championed extravagant State Department funding for the war instigator Ahmad Chalabi, who’d already been branded untrustworthy by the C.I.A. (The relationship between Mr. Chalabi and the former lobbyist Charles Black, now a chief McCain campaign strategist, is explored in a new book, “The Man Who Pushed America to War,” by Aram Roston.)

As for Basra, Mr. McCain told Joe Klein of Time in January that it was “not a problem.” He told John King of CNN while in Baghdad last month that Mr. Sadr’s “influence has been on the wane for a long time.” When the battle ended last week, Mr. McCain said: “Apparently it was Sadr who asked for the cease-fire, declared a cease-fire. It wasn’t Maliki. Very rarely do I see the winning side declare a cease-fire.” At least the last of those sentences was accurate. It was indeed the losing side — Maliki’s — that pleaded for the cease-fire.

Perhaps all these mistaken judgments can be attributed to the fog of war. But Mr. McCain’s bigger strategic picture, immutable no matter what happens on the ground, is foggier still. Like Mr. Bush, he keeps selling Iraq as the central front in the war on Al Qaeda. But Al Qaeda was not even a participant in the Basra battle, which was an eruption of a Shiite-vs.-Shiite civil war. (Al Qaeda is busy enough in Afghanistan and Pakistan, the actual central front in the war on terror.)

Mr. McCain is also fond of portraying Mr. Maliki’s “democracy” in Iraq as an essential bulwark against Iran; his surrogate Lindsey Graham habitually refers to Mr. Sadr’s Mahdi Army as “Iranian-backed militias.” But the political coalition and militia propping up Mr. Maliki are even closer to Iran than the Sadrists. (It was Maliki who gave Alminijhad full honors when the latter visited IRaq). McClatchy Newspapers reported last week that the Maliki-Sadr cease-fire was not only brokered in Iran but by a general whose name is on the Treasury Department’s terrorist list: the commander of the Quds force of Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard.


w.nytimes.com/2008/04/06/opinion/06rich.html?ex=1208145600&en=baa0174e437a2be6&ei=5 070&emc=eta1
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Old 04-07-2008, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Noibn View Post
Then you're just not paying attention. Then as cavalier as you seem to be about these things, maybe you reaaly aren;t aware.
Me cavalier? Can I ask, who are you paying attentiuon to? Perhaps you have some links to all this murdering of innocent women and children? Seems like every time this comes up the stories dry up like dog crap on the lawn.
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Old 04-07-2008, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Commissioner View Post
Me cavalier? Can I ask, who are you paying attentiuon to? Perhaps you have some links to all this murdering of innocent women and children? Seems like every time this comes up the stories dry up like dog crap on the lawn.

All too easy. (Don;t forget the 1.5-2 million refugees outside Iraq and another million (+/-) inside the country.)

Yes, cavalier...as in Cheney's, "So?"

Dozens of Children Killed in Iraq Attack (washingtonpost.com)
=============================

82,000-89,000: Estimate of Iraqi civilians casualties from violence since the beginning of the Iraq War. [Iraq Body Count]
Iraq Casualties, Iraq Costs, Iraq Numbers - Politics on The Huffington Post
=======================================

Iraq Body Count

==============================================

800 Civilians Feared Dead in Fallujah
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Old 04-07-2008, 06:33 PM
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Noibn,

It doesn't matter how many links you post - they'll still deny everything. Ignoring the issue makes them feel better. If they admitted the truth, then they would have to admitt they have been fools. And for some.... they just can't handle the pain.
Ignorance is bliss!!!
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Old 04-07-2008, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Commissioner View Post
Actually, there really wasn't a bunch of lieing going on. There was some bad intelligence that everybody including the United Nations was going with. But no, you would be wrong on the lieing part. Nobody really lied...unless you're including Valerie Plame and that pimp Joe Wilson she's married to.
>>>Nonsense. The Joint Chiefs said before the war that Saddam was "contained". At least they said that until they were slapped down. The rest of the so-called intelligence was straight out of a Judith Miller book and/or Ahmed Chalabi who made a fortune telling the neocons what they wanted to hear. The entire fiasco was a conspiracy of lies.
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Old 04-07-2008, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Noibn View Post
All too easy. (Don;t forget the 1.5-2 million refugees outside Iraq and another million (+/-) inside the country.)

Yes, cavalier...as in Cheney's, "So?"

Dozens of Children Killed in Iraq Attack (washingtonpost.com)
=============================

82,000-89,000: Estimate of Iraqi civilians casualties from violence since the beginning of the Iraq War. [Iraq Body Count]
Iraq Casualties, Iraq Costs, Iraq Numbers - Politics on The Huffington Post
=======================================

Iraq Body Count

==============================================

800 Civilians Feared Dead in Fallujah
A couple of left wing blogs and websites? The Hufington Post? Common Dreams? Do you have any evidence from someone not subsidfized by George Soros? LOL

By the way, the Washington Post article is about a car bomb. Didn't read the whole thing, but was that bomb set off by U.S. troops?




Do you have anything, you know,
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by George O Well View Post
>>>Nonsense. The Joint Chiefs said before the war that Saddam was "contained". At least they said that until they were slapped down. The rest of the so-called intelligence was straight out of a Judith Miller book and/or Ahmed Chalabi who made a fortune telling the neocons what they wanted to hear. The entire fiasco was a conspiracy of lies.
But of course you can't name any specific lies. Looks likes ome real bad intelligence. You sdon't refute anything. But at least you don't use a bunch of Soros-financed blogs and websites to back up your pathetic theory.

I'll just say I don't knbow if anyone lied until I see some real proof.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by naturemomma View Post
Noibn,

It doesn't matter how many links you post - they'll still deny everything. Ignoring the issue makes them feel better. If they admitted the truth, then they would have to admitt they have been fools. And for some.... they just can't handle the pain.
Ignorance is bliss!!!


One question: Whos' willing to believe who's BS? Sounds like somebody's got you pretty well hooked to honey.
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