__________________
S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall

Funny post. Keep to the party line. I believe our military is the finest in the world, not inept at all, but they aren't perfect. They also don't make the decisions on their own. My responses were initially toward Georges contention that fighters should have been in the air and responding to the threats within one hour. I happen to agree with that. Unfortunately, the series of events that day lead to confusion and inaction...not on the part of the military, but the administration.
Not being a "Bush basher", I look at things objectively with an eye toward reality.
The reality is that the answers are not as simple as you'd like them to be. The situation was far from clear-cut an hour into it.
Oh, and by the way, it was your silly contention that every inch of the skies has been covered for forty years...you should have specified it every inch of the skies ABOVE 30k feet.
Believe what you want, it makes little difference to me.

See. I admitted I didn't know if they were or not. You guys really need to get your stories straight though, one claims they can be engaging targets within 5 mins and the other says it doesn't take much more than 5 mins to scramble.
I'll have to take your word, you being a military specialist and all, but it would seem the intercepts would be directed more toward INCOMING threats. It would also seem a BEAR bomber coming in over Alaska or The east coast would present a far more readily established target than a civilain airliner and would present far fewer questions of intent.
But its nice to know, as a superpower, all the contingencies have been worked out.

You try slapping those side winders on pylons its not that easy.

Radar without a transponder tells you nothing. With all the planes in the air there was no way to know. FAA are not Forward Air Controlers. There was no way to pick those planes out even with a vector. Falcons are fast but not that damn fast. NORAD is no longer the system you think of from movies like Wargames. Even art there hight they were practicing to deal with a known incoming threat from over the North Poll.

These guy were obvioulsy all clueless. Whats concering is the FBI, CIA, NSA agents reporting they were told to look away from the warning signs.

Pneumatic force would have forced some lateral movement. I am not a physicist, but I would assume that the lateral movement would not cease after the pneumatic forces were no longer a factor. There is also some evidence of a greater pneumatic force towards the bottom of the building, which only stand to reason.

near the bottom? lmao.... so now, not only did a sixty ton girder travel over a hundred yards, it did it from the bottom? Against gravity?

Tell ya what sherlock... watch the moments of actual impact. see the flaming debris exiting the building at several hundred miles per hour? How far did that travel in the 800 feet it had to fall?

Don't worry, no one will ever confuse you with a physicist.

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S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall

The Hijackings were CALLED IN!!!! how much time do you need? It's NOT just the single transponder event... there are no less the FIVE CONFLUENT events that even a cavemen would recognize as TROUBLE!

AGAIN SCHLOMO, EVERY OTHER TIME THIS HAS BEEN THE CASE, FIGHTERS WERE NEXT TO THE SUSPECT PLANE IN LESS THAN FIFTEEN MINUTES. They DID NOT go blindly off to the edges of our borders scanning the horizon for MIGs with binoculars. GIVE ME A BREAK!!!!!

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S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall

I didn't say that the girder came from the bottom. I said that evidence of pneumatic forces were present. besides, it is only logical to assume that those forces were there. Of course debris is going to exit the building, that is what the pneumatic force would do. You have thought about pneumatic forces haven't you?

Are you claiming that you are a physicist? I thought physicists actually had degrees from colleges? That would eliminate you.

Called in? uh the Gioverment was sking spain if they saw any suspcious people that morining. Americna airpsace is barely controled chaos. This crap about scrambled fighters everyday is a farce. If everytime some busy pilot failed to respond or some piece of equipment failed there be USAF all over the skies everywhere.

Its pretty hard to find a plane in the air.

You know nothing of my academic accomplishments. But then... why would a lack of knowledge stop a neo-con apologist from starting something as fact.

As far as "pneumatic forces"... you are completely right, there were. But what you fail to realize for the gazillionth time... is that every time you add a new explanation, it removes energy from the system. trying to explain the complete destruction of the massive core columns, the pyroclastic flows, the energy to pulverize every last ounce of concrete on every single floor, AND NOW pneumatic processes flinging semi truck sized beams 100 yards...

THERE IS NOT ENOUGH ENERGY IN A GRAVITATIONAL COLLAPSE TO ACCOUNT FOR ALL OF THESE FACTORS. The weight of the buildings had a KNOWN downward energy capability. Since energy can neither be created nor destroyed... you can't get something fro nothing... it is IMPOSSIBLE (and trust me, I don't use that word very often) for all these events to be attributable to a gravitational collapse.

But you've been told this before... and you just hold up your ignorance of the physical realm as a "as long as I don't know better, I can say anything I want" excuse.

You do realize that for the girder to make this trip in a gravitational collapse, it had to come from near the top of the building. Not much weight up there to propel something with pneumatic forces. especially when the compression table is moving at incredible speed AWAY from the compression actuator. It's like closing the jaws on a vice, except that the jaws never close because they are both moving... in the same direction. The ONLY place where the compression table would have been unmoving enough to supply close to the force you need to make your layman's theory to work... IS AT THE BOTTOM!

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S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall