 |
|

05-27-2008, 03:51 AM
|
 |
Political Mastermind
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,409
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanite
how quaint.
religion is always a metaphysical assertion, atheism is not. end of story.
|
no its not.
you have no idea what is or isn't out there. you don't know all the secrets of life or the universe.
you can't know what happens after death and you don't know how life began. we know evolution is real, but we don't know how the first cell came about or the first planet. or the universe.
it stands to reason that something or someone had to get the ball rolling.
__________________
Psych Majors are JUNG and HORNEY
Freedom is SEXY
|

05-27-2008, 09:17 AM
|
 |
Political Junkie
|
|
Join Date: May 2008
Location: El Paso, TX
Posts: 102
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAIDER56
I have studied in college the difference between western and eastern religious thought
and have concluded that no one really knows anything for sure.Because you believe
or dont believe in something does not make it so.As an atheist you make assumptions
that there is no God.As most of the rest of us choose the comfort of the believe that
there is a higher intelligence out there.What if your wrong?
"If you believe in nothing ,you must therefore believe in something"
|
My educational experiences in college and elsewhere support your statement that no one really knows for sure. Belief doesn't make it so, and disbelief doesn't make it no so. The impact from both western and eastern spiritual technologies (at least the essence of these beliefs) is in the application of their principles in our daily life. By acting like Jesus, or the Buddha, or Muhammad, or Lao Tzu, or others, will I find meaning, happiness, enlightment, the Kingdom of God. I believe in higher realities because I believe in lower realities. Take our body for example. At one level it’s one living body, at another its billions of living creatures, cells that work together and some that don’t (virus, cancerous, parasites). We are aware of that reality but the cells are probably unaware of a larger reality outside their little universe. Also, the earth is a body made up of billions of living creatures too and perhaps a higher reality. The universe, billions of earth-like bodies making up an even larger reality. Mostly speculation but their does appear to be some hierarchy. If there is a hierarchy there is likely an ultimate reality, God. I'd rather think that than not think that.
__________________
"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke
"Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes, that he also believes to be true. " Demosthenes
|

05-27-2008, 02:07 PM
|
|
Political Mastermind
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,398
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf_22
no its not.
you have no idea what is or isn't out there. you don't know all the secrets of life or the universe.
you can't know what happens after death and you don't know how life began. we know evolution is real, but we don't know how the first cell came about or the first planet. or the universe.
it stands to reason that something or someone had to get the ball rolling.
|
A few points. I am making the claim that "we don't know whats out there". Though, specifically, that this knowledge isn't only unattainable, but that it doesn't exist. There isn't truth or essence, these are CONTINGENT elements found within the history of language. I can point to people and places where your ideas originated. You think that the language of someone from the past is going to be sufficient? There is a reason why religion statistically declines in more affluent countries around the world... its not within a modern context. Its not that helpful. No one reads Mark Twain anymore, not like they read chuck palanuik or watch movies.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrankyYankee
Atheists believe a negation, not an assertion. By definition you cannot be assertive.
Sorry.
|
to "believe" is theistic. a negation.. thats eastern. By definition, an atheist makes no metaphysical claims; it is a position devoid of theory, atheoretical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inelpaso
My educational experiences in college and elsewhere support your statement that no one really knows for sure. Belief doesn't make it so, and disbelief doesn't make it no so. The impact from both western and eastern spiritual technologies (at least the essence of these beliefs) is in the application of their principles in our daily life. By acting like Jesus, or the Buddha, or Muhammad, or Lao Tzu, or others, will I find meaning, happiness, enlightment, the Kingdom of God. I believe in higher realities because I believe in lower realities. Take our body for example. At one level it’s one living body, at another its billions of living creatures, cells that work together and some that don’t (virus, cancerous, parasites). We are aware of that reality but the cells are probably unaware of a larger reality outside their little universe. Also, the earth is a body made up of billions of living creatures too and perhaps a higher reality. The universe, billions of earth-like bodies making up an even larger reality. Mostly speculation but their does appear to be some hierarchy. If there is a hierarchy there is likely an ultimate reality, God. I'd rather think that than not think that.
|
cells dont have language dog
|

05-27-2008, 02:13 PM
|
|
Machiavelli Incarnate
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,015
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by smart makes a comeback
Quite simply, it is the abilty to distinguish the differnce between art, literature, fiction, objective thought, and fictional non secularism.
I think this is self evident,is it not ?
Or, is there some point you are trying to make based on the difinitive answer ?
Funny you mention Pascal in this question...are you sure you meant to do that ?
|
As much as I like to attack you on points, I also like to give credit. Well stated. Agree 100%, ney 110%
|

05-27-2008, 02:15 PM
|
|
Machiavelli Incarnate
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,015
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAIDER56
I have studied in college the difference between western and eastern religious thought
and have concluded that no one really knows anything for sure.Because you believe
or dont believe in something does not make it so.As an atheist you make assumptions
that there is no God.As most of the rest of us choose the comfort of the believe that
there is a higher intelligence out there.What if your wrong?
"If you believe in nothing ,you must therefore believe in something"
|
If I am wrong, I am wrong. If your god wants to condemn me to hell solely because I didn't believe in him, then you are welcomed to him.
|

05-27-2008, 02:23 PM
|
|
Machiavelli Incarnate
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,015
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by wolf_22
well, how do christians value hindu art?
or vise versa?
the basis of the art doesn't have to effect its beauty.
|
To expand the question a tad, the lack of understanding of a religion can affect the understanding of the art in question. For instance, how much of us can really appreciate Hindu art without understanding what the significance of what some of the figures mean? I mean pure aesthetics can only carry one so far. I do know that I began to appreciate Buddhist art a heck of a lot more when I begin to know more about it and all those saint pictures mean more when you know the symbolism involved regarding each saint.
Now of course anyone can learn this outside of accepting the religion.
|

05-27-2008, 02:27 PM
|
 |
Machiavelli Incarnate
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: mountains of East TN
Posts: 9,239
|
|
Its all about the joooooooooooooooooooooooos
__________________
Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy
|

05-27-2008, 02:32 PM
|
|
Machiavelli Incarnate
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,015
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanite
how quaint.
religion is always a metaphysical assertion, atheism is not. end of story.
|
Uhm, atheism is a metaphyscial assertion. There is no (assertion) God (metaphysics).
You know. Agnosticism looks better every passing day here :-)
|

05-27-2008, 02:47 PM
|
 |
Political Junkie
|
|
Join Date: May 2008
Location: El Paso, TX
Posts: 102
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by smart makes a comeback
Sorry Raider..not buying it
Methinks you have entered into Pascals wager, and it is a sucker bet
The point is...the idea that one has to embrace theology, to understand non secular content, is just plain silly
|
I agree, one need not embrace theology to understand non-secular content but it helps, just as one doesn't have to embrace medicine to understand medicine. I would perfer the doctor who embraced medicine. You do not embrass theology, I assume, but you claim to understand it???
__________________
"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke
"Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes, that he also believes to be true. " Demosthenes
|

05-27-2008, 02:56 PM
|
 |
Political Junkie
|
|
Join Date: May 2008
Location: El Paso, TX
Posts: 102
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanite
cells dont have language dog
|
They got cell phones idiot. Seriously burb look into "cell signaling", cell communicate with each other no sht.
__________________
"All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke
"Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes, that he also believes to be true. " Demosthenes
|
| Thread Tools |
|
|
| Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
|