no slug trail on the way out

Your homosexual fantasies regarding me are amusing, but I cannot say that I am honored by them.

>>>You're either with us or against us, pal. (Whether or not God actually exists.)

oh, i thought you were a girl, on account of the way you keep bitching

Ah, look everyone. The pot is talking!

I read your quote and it was good. I don't mind if you want to make agnosticism a subset of atheism. I am in fact an agnositic atheist then as opposed to a confirmed atheist I guess.

I personally am not afraid of the atheist lable, but in many peoples minds atheist has a different definition. Perhaps they are lazy or ignorant thinking people but if I tell most people I know that I'm atheist instead of agnostic, they assume that I'm 100% sure that there's no such thing as god or gods.

So I call myself an agnostic because the only thing I'm 100% sure of is that it's impossible to know for sure if there is or isn't a god/s. To me this is the only truly honest position to take. Unfortunately it leads to fights with both theists and atheists alike, because I firmly believe that they can't know any better than I can.

As an American, I fully support your right to choose to be an atheist or a theist. I just wish that people would admit it's a choice and not try to claim they know the 'right' answer for everyone else.

It is not being afraid of the label "atheist" that is the issue, hell I know that the "theists" will insist on it, rather, as you pointed out that, it is important to distinguish between those who insist they know there is no god, to those who don't believe there is no god.

The importance of the distinction is that it makes it easier to appeal to the majority of "theists" who could accept a live and let live policy (I call them faith-holders or spiritualists and opposed to the "theists" who insist that their way is the only way and everyone else has to conform to their way (they can also be called fundamentalists, but I have met many people who are fundamentalists that are willing to leave others alone)). Whereas many hard core atheists, and indeed the very name "atheist" makes it difficult to appeal to them because they see it as an attack on their faith.

In a democracy building a coalition is important towards assuring that your goals are achieved. Since a vast majority of people in this country believe that god exists, alienating all of them is counter productive. So it is important that we appeal to those that can be appealed to.

And furthermore, it is what "agnostics" believe. If you really don't know, then you have no issues with those who do think they know. The only issue you DO have is when they try to impose their beliefs on to you. That is what you need to attack, so your arguments should be tailored to peel off those theists who are willing to let people live and let live while isolating those who want to impose something onto you.

You're right. Building coalitions is important and being less threatening or harsh in your opinions helps with that for sure.

I didn't think of any of that when I decided to be an agnostic. In my case, I kind of inherited it from my mother. My father is a confirmed atheist and my mother is agnostic. They used to argue about it and I felt my mom won. My favorite quote from her was, "Not being able to admit you MIGHT be wrong doesn't make you right, it only makes you arrogant" Since my dad really is an arrogant son of a bitch, I decided to take after Mom instead.

The trouble with atheists is that they are exactly like people who take glee in telling children that there is no Santa Claus. Yeah, its true and all, but what sort of bastard does that? Now I know that God is not Santa Claus and adults are not children, but the same principle applies. If a belief in God gives someone comfort in this harsh universe, as long as they don't try to force it on others, what sort of bastard needs to rip that comfort away from them?

Nope, I don't have enough faith to be an athiest. Stating absolutely that there is no diety possible is a matter of faith - and I am faithless...

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Miss Vicky - VictorDanilchenko, proven and shameless liar

http://www.arguewitheveryone.com/gen...tml#post709726