There are so many things that the different christian denominations cannot agree on its baffling , especially to the non christian.

Like the issue : if a Christian ( follower of Christs Teachings) should participate in war?

Does anybody want to study what the bible actually says about how a follower of christ is to treat our enemies?.... Lets do it!

Matthew 22:36-37 Master which is the greatest commandment in the Law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all they soul, and with all thy mind.This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it. Love thy neighbor as thyself. All the law and the prophets hang on these two commandments
The words of our Lord and savior christ here in red. And he says that all law , commandments, and teachings hang on the Love of God and the Love of others.

Did he exclude others from that love? Who are our neighbors? Does that mean we are to love just the people on our street? Or the people in our community? Do countries have neighbors? Who are these neighbors?

And what did Christ say about our enemies? Here is one scripture that comes to my mind.

Matthew5:44But I tell you : Love your enemies and pray for those that persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes the sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and unrighteous .

Verse 48. Be ye perfect therefore , as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Jesus 's own words telling us to love our enemies . Is there any scripture where Jesus tells us to hate or kill our enemies? And Jesus says we should be perfect as the Father in Heaven is perfect, is this possible for a human to be perfect? What a thought ! I thought humans were never perfect so why would Christ hold us to such a high standard?

Lots of interesting questions for study in this topic about if a christian ( follower of Christ )should participate in war.

I offer the following site only because it offers lots of scriptures on the subject and will save me the time of typing them all out. It is done in dark colors and I do not read in those colors well. If anybody is computer literate enough to change it to a white background , please, please do so and post it so we all can discuss it,.

Citizenship Article- This link offers biblical reasons for a follower of Christ for rejecting military service and war. It gives lots of scripture is why I chose it . It will require some study and reading.

I look forward to a fruitful discussion on the topic.

To get ready for the Muslim hoards?

__________________
When seconds count, Police are only minutes away.

Come now woman , we can't just let people run over us.

But a interesting topic. I will look at it more.

Can someone be a Christian and serve in the Military and or have a career in Law Enforcement?

If a Christian believes that it is wrong to SERVE(with serve being the key term), then would it not also be wrong to take advantages of either of these services? Would not one be living in a state of hypocrisy if the next time that there was trouble or we were attacked, one would call out for the help of either of these services? Perhaps some should call on a group of tree hugging pacifists to protect them from the crime that is becoming rampant in this new secular government and one world order.

Ecclesiastes 3:1-8....The wise man of God says there is a time..........

Moses knew there was a time to Kill when he defended his oppressed brethren (Acts 7:22-35, Exodus 2:12, 3:10).

The Christ knew there would come a time when one would have to pick up a sword and defend his faith....(Luke 22:35-38).

In John 15:12-13.....Jesus said, "This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this, than to lay down one's own life for his friends. (Also 1 John 3:16). Men and women who "SERVE" in law enforcement and the military may be asked to lay down their lives in "our" protection, are we not fellow men or friends? These brave men and women sacrifice their needs, hopes, desires, and even their lives to "SERVE" and to protect others...according to the Christ, a most noble thing indeed.

Luke 10:27...proclaims that we must love our neighbors as we love ourselves. Just as this means do them no harm, it must also mean....allow no harm to come to them.

Luke 3:12-14...John the Baptist told the tax collectors and soldiers what? Give up your occupation? No.

Matthew 8:5-10.....Jesus the Christ does not condemn the work of the "Centurion".....a man who served in command of at least 100 soldiers beneath him. But rather, He commends his faith.

Luke 14:31-32.....Christ discusses kings talking counsel before battle. Would he use an illustration which did not have his approval?

Luke 27:35-38....Jesus tells His disciples that after He is gone, that they would need a "SWORD"----and it would be of greater value than even their garments.

Acts 10....EVEN THE "VERY FIRST" GENTILE CHRISTIAN was a "soldier"....a Roman Centurion, at the house of "CORNELIUS".

Read 1 Timothy 2:3-4...concerning the "lawful" striving of Christian battle.

The sixth commandment "THOU SHALT NOT KILL" should be carefully considered and taken in the context from which it was given. People who grew up reading the KJ version of the Bible, and whose intent was and remains to simply understand Gods will and obey it, should know beyond a shadow of a doubt that "thou shalt not kill", did not prohibit "all" killings. Any through student of the Bible could learn that there were animal sacrifices under the OT law(LEV 1-8), that God sanctioned eating meets in (Gen. 9:3) and (Acts 10:10-15). At times God guided his armies in battle (Joshua 6), and commanded capital punishment in (Gen 9:6). In (Proverbs 6:-17) we learn that God hates the hand that spills "INNOCENT" blood.....notice he did not say hands that spilled all blood, but innocent blood.

God also allows self defense as we read of the young David slaying both lions and bears in defense of his "flock" (1 Samuel 17), in (v.37) David said, that it was the Lord who delivered him against the beasts and thus would also deliver him against the Philistine(Goliath).

Is not the "military" of this nation simply defending the "innocent flock"..IE we the people...against the beasts of this world that would bring us harm? For its very obvious indeed that "thou shalt not kill" means "you shall not commit murder". BD

And I shall take the time when I can to look at it in detail . But I think that we should try for the purposes of the study to remain in the New Testament. I think this for this reason. Christ came to expand on the commandments and the New Testament is just that Christ telling his followers his commands. To be sure Christ spoke in the OT too , but as his name was never used it cannot be agreed upon by all Christians as to where. So the new Testament of Christ just makes more sense. After all the topic is " What did Christ teach his followers about war?"

For now some thoughts if I may on what you wrote that just pop into my head.

Luke 3:14 And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying and what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely and be content with your wages.
Here we have John the baptist telling soldiers to do violence to no man. Strange contradiction for a soldier and he does not tell them to quit because he says be content with their wages .

But a important part of this scripture would be accuse no man falsely.How can a soldier in the field know when he is ordered to kill that his commanders are telling him the truth and not accusing another falsely? This seems a real dilemma for the real followers of Christ.

John 15 - I would have to ask you to read the entire 15th chapter of John BD. Actually start with the 14th chapterJesus is preparing his followers for his coming crucifixion .This scripture has nothing to do with war either. When he says Greater love hath no man than this , that a man lay down his life for his friends . The next verse s go on to show Jesus intent was to calm them and make them realize he was going to be crucified and it was God's plan. Verse 18:If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.

Verse 20Remember the Word that I said unto you, the servant is not greater than his Lord if they have persecuted me they will all so persecute you.

They persecuted Jesus all right. They killed him. The servant is not greater than his Lord. Are we so fond of our own skins we think we deserve better than our Lord?

Read John 14, 15 and 16 these entire three chapters are about the coming crucifixion Of Christ it has nothing to do with war. Indeed in John 16 These things have I spoken unto you that you shall not be offended. They shall put you out of the synagogues : yea the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he does God a service. And these things will they do unto you , because they have not known the Father, nor me. But these things have I told you, that when the time shall come, you may remember that I told you them. And these things I said not unto you at the beginning , because I was with you. But now I go away to him who sent me.

Christ was preparing his followers for his coming death. And the fact they could expect to be persecuted and killed for spreading the message Christ brought them. How do you get war from these scriptures BD? I hope you will read the entirety of John 14, 15 and 16 and respond.

gotta to tell you BD I did not intend to take much time looking at your post, as its a beautiful sunny day here. But I have looked a little further now and see that you have picked and chosen sentences from scripture and not posted the entire scripture or accurately given its meaning. And I got to tell you I know most of the scriptures you posted and you are not posting the entire scripture. You are picking a sentence here and there to suit your view. As I said when I have time I will comment on the rest of your post. Because my brother its important that the true mesage of Christ get out to unbelievers . Not a sentence here and there that somebody picks to make their own scripture.

The authority to turn the phrase "turn the other cheek"

into "YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO GET FUCKED"

Why was MAN not Woman given the job of spiritual leader in that book you women worship as god, and USE to try too CUNTROLL ANGER with.

DID JESUS GET ANGRY AND KICK MONEY CHANGERS ASSES ???



THE FALSE PROPHETS ARE CUNT TROLLS

None of Christ's teachings has anything to do with being the "aggressor" in any conflict...but the teachings of the OT tell us indeed just how God looks upon any situation, as we use these teachings to gain insight as to what God actually considers and what He does not. The only thing that has changed from the OT is the legalities of covenants that bind mankind....none of the teachings or words of wisdom were done away with...only that which was contrary to man gaining salvation as the OT covenant of Moses could not in fact offer salvation. The reference of OT teachings in this regard is clearly acceptable as much of it is openly referenced by the Christ himself. What one gains from this study, is the fact that God allows self defense of both life and property....and He very clearly states the absolutes of what is right and what is wrong. BD

BD

I prayed too late about how to respond to your post BD. I was outside pulling tomato plants from the garden when it came to that I had done you wrong again. I apologize.

I will pray about all responses to you before I respond from now on in this thread BD. I do not want a study to seem at any way confrontational. And my last paragraph in my reply is not what studying together is about.

I was going to change it and take that out , hoping you had not seen it yet, but I cannot edit my posts on this forum for some reason . Anybody know why that happens?

So I apologize for my overly zealous response to you BD . It will not happen again.

Paula

The words of scripts were "picked" due to their reference of the study....is it Christian to serve in the Military or to serve under arms of law enforcement? All the verses were chosen....and none of them were taken out of their contextual message, they were chosen because they answered the question from a Biblical perspective....not man made "opinion". The Christ indeed taught the passive lifestyle as His mission upon this earth was to be a "sacrificial lamb"...even He made the statement that He could with one word, have a host of angles to defend his "innocent" mission, but He chose not to....for it would have made His life's mission "non-effect" and we would still be offering up yearly alter sacrifices to carry our sins over in hopes of the coming "Messiah".

But the fact that Christ indeed fulfilled his mission takes none of the other scripts away that clearly show that man has a God given right to self defend his life and his property....we all should strive to live by the passive example set by the Christ, but we must never let our faith fall beneath the feet of any aggression....to either our life or our property. Why should we fall victim to aggression when we try to live a passive life style and are asked to defend our family and our property because of someone else and their lack of Biblical principals. There is no need to apologize for having the pages of the "holy scripts" open in an attempt to reason together.....as I have become very passive when I am "attacked" for presenting the words of the scriptures and the truth that they bring on any given subject. When I present "opinion", I will be the first to inform you that it is opinion only and has no scriptural foundation. There is nothing personal in any of my posts....regarding religion and Biblical scripts, I only defend what is written and present such when asked. BD

I agree and the Old Testament is directly tied time and again to the new testament so you are right BD the old testament should be allowed in this discussion. I apologize for even thinking it shouldn't.

But let me write this to you and see if you understand me better. There is no authority modern christians accept except the English translations of the bible. I believe we can agree this is correct?

The last words we have recorded from God are in the new testament and are from either his Son Christ our Lord, or the apostles . I believe we can agree too that this is correct?
Gods message in the Old Testament is very different than God's message in the New Testament. I think it is very different. But here I would have to ask your opinion as to what you think BD?

I see the message Christ brought to us as very different than the old testament message. And Christ said he spoke only words he had heard the father God speak. Christ said he and the Father were of one accord concerning Christs words and we could count on his Words being from God the Father. Christ was most concerned that his followers so model his commands that the world would know them as followers of Christ. Christ wanted us to set our selfs out from among the world so that unbelievers might see us and know we were different. Remember when Stephen was stoned he did not resist, he did not fight, scriptures gives no mention of Stephen doing anything to save his own life. In fact Stephen was said to die saying. Father lay not this sin upon their charge. Stephen faced his death as I believe Christ was telling us to do in the previous chapters you mentioned John 14, 15 and 16. I hope I have explained myself well enough BD that you understand where I am coming from?