Oh, you mean like the great independent thinkers on the left who say that both Bill and Hillary Clinton are Republicans and that the Blue Dogs should be kicked out because they are really Republicans?

Again, your entire post was wrong . . . impressively so.

You know this makes me think....One thing that I found really spineless about Joe Lieberman, I mean the guy even talks like a spineless pussy, was that regardless he was fairly voted out of his parties primary & instead of being a man about it & bowing out he just craps in everyones face & goes independent.

If he were SOO independent from the beginning he'd have run that way. He wasn't he was putting on the cloak of one party & pretty much voting the way of the other party.

That's fine but call yourself what you are then. Either a Republican or whatever form of independent you say you are from the beginning.

He just did it because he can't leave the teet of being a Senator.

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The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw.
- Jack Handy

But he wasn't a Republican. His social issues he was clearly on the left. Now on the biggest issue he may have voted along with Republicans but if you kept a tally sheet then he would definately be a Democrat. That one issue is outweighing all the others. Libermann is not a Republican, but that only further illustrates my point I made earlier and counters Okham that people on the left look at people who don't vote the way they do on an issue and label them the opposite party.

Thanks Crow, I might not have thought of that example.

I haven't got a clue what the hell you're talking about... Blue Dogs? Clinton Republicans... What does that have to do with putting down legitimate questions of our public servants? What does that have to do with demonizing anyone and everyone that poses opposition to the power element of this admin?

Tell ya what, let me cut to the chase...

Forget everything I have said previously... the only independent thinkers in America today are those that can get beyond the left/right paradigm to find the root causes of our problems. Thinking that either of these parties has anything to offer Joe Pedestrian, is retarded. Thinking that either of these parties is going to fix what's broken is retarded. Thinking that either of these parties has any intention of bowing to the power of the people... is retarded. Dom, it is mho, that the left is closer to reaching that conclusion than the right. But neither has "leadership" that will benefit Us.

So you can all keep running circles around who gets more favorable press coverage, who has more independent thinkers, who does the most damage, who is more corrupt... but it doesn't matter.

The preeminent issues that should be on EVERYONES MIND, is how do we retake our representatives from the special interests, the corporations and the money brokers? How do we stabilize our economy and grow without a debt based currency?

I've been coming here for a year and a half or so... and I keep seeing the same circles being run over and over. Left this, right that... blah blah blah... it's all hot air.

And surprise surprise... nothing changes... at all....

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S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall

It has everything to do with what I quoted from yoru post when I made that response. I don't often agree with you Okham, but I don't think you are stupid, which is why I think you are deliberately playing dumb with this statement. You said that people on the right call anyone who doesn't agree with them Democrats and I showed you where some people on the left do just the opposite . . . except I gave examples of actual posters doing that.

Wouldn't those people who get hung up on R/L paradigms be the same ones who claim one side has some monopoly on a certain type of thinking though?

I pretty much see D's and R's as fundamentally the same on a lot of issues, it is just that those issues are not at the forefront because they don't distinguish the candidates. There are some who decide waht to think based upon what their party leaders tell them to think.

For example, a lot of the anti-war people are fakes. They say they want to end the war but they really just don't want a Republican in office. When Hillary Clinton says that she will keep troops there those SAME anti-war people say it is OK if she does it . . . all the while bitching abotu how if Giuliani wins he will keep troops in Iraq. Face it, those people are fakes. They are only following the party line. When people like Charles Krauthammer and Bill Kristol are praising Hillary Clinton those same anti-war people come up with all kinds of excuses for this . . . ignoring the fact that she is closer to the definition of a neocon than a lot of the people labeled as such.

Actually, I said they are labled as liberal, not Dem... big difference, especially in the eyes of the right.

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S.O.S. ------ United We Stand, Divided We Fall

Specifics can be pointed out where what you say is true Dom. From my personal experience on here I have encountered COUNTLESS times where I'm pigeonholed because I disagree with someones post as being apart of the stupid binary way of thinking. Come on how many times have I heard Socialist, far left, Commie, Satan worshiping, Liberal. It happens more often than not on the 'right'. I have seen it here & I've seen it on other boards. It is quite entertaining for me actually & makes it easier to mess with those that think in that way.

Admittedly I will pester those on the 'left' spectrum from time to time as well for doing the same binary stupidity but If I were to do a statistical analysis I would find that it more often happens & has been & continues to be framed from the 'right' in this binary mindset than I've seen from the other white meat...the framed 'left'.

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The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw.
- Jack Handy

The people who do that label all Dems liberal, so no difference at all. Of course, there are just as many of those people on the left, so it doesn't really matter a whole lot anyway.

That's where I personally disagree. There are those that are vocal & post constantly that seem to skew it that way but beyond that I don't think that is correct.

__________________
The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw.
- Jack Handy