North Korea claims nuclear weapons test

Politicon · #41 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RASTAMAN

Well it has become abundantly clear which COUNTRY REALLY HAS WMD. It ain't IRAQ AND it ain't IRAN!

Gee Georgy Porgy how could you and "Shoot Anything That Moves Cheney" miss this one? Were you Dim Witted Fools high on oil.

Dictator Bush is a miserable failure on every issue. Saddam never had WMD and Bush knew it, this is why he never fired anyone who gave him the so called Bad Intellligence. Bush has lost the peace in Iraq--but is helping his war profeetering buddies bilk billions from American Tax payers. The Taliban are nearly back in Power and are only growing stronger.

Bush can't KEEP AMERICA SAFE!! Bush's Cowboy Go-it-Alone Foreign Policy has made America not only less safe, but the laughing stock of the entire world. When Bush came into office NK had no platonium and no Nukes. But guess what 6 years later--THEY SURE AS HELL DO NOW.

Okay Bush supporters and loyalist, shhhhhh.....close your eyes and say this can't be happening and when you wake up tomorrow, NK will destroy thier nukes, Iran will stop their Nuclear ambitions, the Shia, Sunni, and Kurds will suddenly except our occupation with uphoria and flowers; Foley was actually a Democrat, and Bush will call a news conference and aplogize for scaring the living shit out of Americans and for propagandizing the TRUTH!!!

You Conservatives cannot blame Democrats nor can you blame Clinton for this mess you find your party in. Fore you have had the MAJORITY IN THE HOUSE AND SENATE for 12 YEARS AND YOU HAD A REPUBLICAN IN THE OVAL OFFICE FOR 6 FREAKIN YEARS.

CONSERVATIVES: YOUR PARTY, THE GOP MAJORITY IN CONGRESS AND YOUR PRESIDENT ARE ALL IN A STATE OF DENIAL AND IN AN ENDLESS
FREE-FALL.

RASTAMAN, I want to see you make ONE post that doesn’t bash the GOP for world situations. I’m not saying that there weren’t faults; I’m just saying that I have yet to read one intelligent post by you that comments on world affairs without attacking the GOP. Look over this post of yours. You don’t EVEN focus on NK but instead make it your entire goal to blast the Republicans. North Korea does have Nukes. That’s a HUGE problem, but as far as America goes we should take comfort in that their economy is incredibly unstable and completely reliant on China. Their rockets can not make it past Japan (although the fact that their ranges do include Japan and SK does present an enormous problem). North Korea is very very unstable. That doesn’t diminish the problem, but I find comfort in that China could pull the plug on their life support at any time. O, before you even get me started on Foley take a look at what Democrats have done in the past. I don’t think either party can be claiming to be the best party on this issue. Then again, I’m sure this is all Bush’s fault. After all, I’m sure Bush arranged this Nuke test to get the pressure back on national security issues and off of Foley.

Dom1 · #42 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:50 PM

China will work to stop North Korea. China does not want any more nuclear powers int he region, and if NK further develops their program, Japan will follow.

Politicon · #43 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chateauroux

Politicon, you're living in a dream world if you believe the Chinese will do ANYTHING to make North Korea implode! What, and have millions of starving North Koreans pour over the Yalu into China? South Korea would want it less with millions of starving North Koreans flooding across the DMZ. They remember when the Berlin Wall went down and West Germany had to pick up the tab for the East Germans. Multiply that a thousandfold and you'd see what the South Koreans would be up against. Their economy would go in the tank, FAST!!

I don’t believe that the Chinese will do anything at the moment. What I am saying is that the Chinese will be very disappointed (to say the least) that the countries in the region will be turning back and becoming closer with the US. If NK does decided to do something even more stupid, would it be so improvable that China could cut them off or even put in place a puppet government following a coup? After all, that would settle the region down after the necessary events had occurred, there would be less of a reason for the countries in the region to grow closer to the US, and China would be one step closer to becoming the sole dominating power in the region. Just a thought.

graybeard · #44 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Politicon

I don’t believe that the Chinese will do anything at the moment. What I am saying is that the Chinese will be very disappointed (to say the least) that the countries in the region will be turning back and becoming closer with the US. If NK does decided to do something even more stupid, would it be so improvable that China could cut them off or even put in place a puppet government following a coup? After all, that would settle the region down after the necessary events had occurred, there would be less of a reason for the countries in the region to grow closer to the US, and China would be one step closer to becoming the sole dominating power in the region. Just a thought.

You make some good points. If this scenario was being played out pre 9/11 it would be more feasible than today. IMO because of the Iraq War failures and our diminished stature among the world, one has to wonder whether our influence and might carry the same weight they once did. Can Japan depend on our ability to defend them against a million-man army? Perhaps Japan decides they are now forced into going nuclear themselves because of our inability to defend them.

Politicon · #45 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom1

China will work to stop North Korea. China does not want any more nuclear powers int he region, and if NK further develops their program, Japan will follow.

Agreed. After all, when NK was test firing the long range rocket that could have theoretically hit the US but then failed after 40 some seconds into it's launch (

) the US made agreements with Japan to work cooperatively on missile defense. Think about how much closer and in depth these agreements will be now that NK is nuclear.

Dom1 · #46 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RASTAMAN

Bush can't KEEP AMERICA SAFE!! Bush's Cowboy Go-it-Alone Foreign Policy has made America not only less safe, but the laughing stock of the entire world. When Bush came into office NK had no platonium and no Nukes. But guess what 6 years later--THEY SURE AS HELL DO NOW.

Why don't you answer who helped North Korea get the money to build two nuclear reactors in 1994! What about in 1998 when Begala said that North Korea and their goal of nuclear weapons had been dealt with, and one week later NK shot a test missile over Japan (it landed near the coast of Alaska). One week later! Don't give that bullshit about them not haveing nuclear capablities before 2000, Clinton helped build the reactors. He also eased sanctions against them because they were dismantling their program. Doesn't seem that they were dismantling much when they are testing missiles. You seem to have VERY selective memory.

Politicon · #47 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graybeard

You make some good points. If this scenario was being played out pre 9/11 it would be more feasible than today. IMO because of the Iraq War failures and our diminished stature among the world, one has to wonder whether our influence and might carry the same weight they once did. Can Japan depend on our ability to defend them against a million-man army? Perhaps Japan decides they are now forced into going nuclear themselves because of our inability to defend them.

Very true. In all honesty that remains a strong possibility, especially since our military might is tied up indefinitely in Iraq. That is on of the reasons why I hope we can get that country into a stable state as quickly as possible. Not only would it be good to stop our causalities (as in any war) but we also have lost a lot of our influence since our military is currently engaged. I don’t mean to take this topic off subject, but you make a very good point Graybeard.

Dom1 · #48 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graybeard

You make some good points. If this scenario was being played out pre 9/11 it would be more feasible than today. IMO because of the Iraq War failures and our diminished stature among the world, one has to wonder whether our influence and might carry the same weight they once did. Can Japan depend on our ability to defend them against a million-man army? Perhaps Japan decides they are now forced into going nuclear themselves because of our inability to defend them.

I don't think any perceived inability to defend them would prompt nuclear development. Just the fact that NK has them would be enough reason. I also think our inability to defend Japan is wrong. That million man army would be hard pressed to even make it ashore, and if they did they would have to contend with very little if any air cover and the only navy in the world which can operate on the open sea.

I heard recently that the Japanese hve all the technology, capabilities, and materials they need to go nuclear; but up until now they have not had a reason. I don't think China wants NK to give them a reason.

ken.e · #49 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 08:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom1

I don't think any perceived inability to defend them would prompt nuclear development. Just the fact that NK has them would be enough reason. I also think our inability to defend Japan is wrong. That million man army would be hard pressed to even make it ashore, and if they did they would have to contend with very little if any air cover and the only navy in the world which can operate on the open sea.

I heard recently that the Japanese hve all the technology, capabilities, and materials they need to go nuclear; but up until now they have not had a reason. I don't think China wants NK to give them a reason.

i think japan has just got their reason

Politicon · #50 (**permalink**) 10-09-2006, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom1

I don't think any perceived inability to defend them would prompt nuclear development. Just the fact that NK has them would be enough reason. I also think our inability to defend Japan is wrong. That million man army would be hard pressed to even make it ashore, and if they did they would have to contend with very little if any air cover and the only navy in the world which can operate on the open sea.

I heard recently that the Japanese hve all the technology, capabilities, and materials they need to go nuclear; but up until now they have not had a reason. I don't think China wants NK to give them a reason.

I never thought I would be able to say this, but I’m glad that China in on our side on this matter. I truly believe they would pull the plug on NK before any US military action was necessary. I know I agreed with Graybeard in a previous post, and I still do when it comes to ground troops. While we are in no position to launch a ground invasion of NK, but this really isn’t necessary at the moment in my opinion. Dom, you make an excellent point with the naval and air force considerations. While our ground forces are tied up at the moment, our air, and especially navel forces, are not tied up and are still extremely capable and lethal in that region. The Pacific Fleet encompasses approximately 200 ships, 2,000 aircraft and 250,000 Sailors and Marines. (http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...avy/pacflt.htm) That’s powerful by anyone’s standards. On top of that, there are 6 operating aircraft carriers and 1 other one that is currently being re outfitted. That is a lot of projected force.