Thread: Father of Lies

Originally Posted by Kix

Zou, sorry, but I have to disagree with you here. I know a lot of people would like to believe that there is some replacement covenant or that there is some way they can become God's chosen, but I'm afraid it's not something that we can control. If most people understood the facts about being God's chosen and the burden it carries with it, they would probably run screaming from the concept. The fact is, many Jews have done just that. Even still, what other people could possibly endure thousands of years of God's expectations and mans' jealousy and hatred?

Despite their sins and rejection of Him, God's covenant with his chosen people (Israel) has not been completed and will not be for some time to come. There is nowhere in the Bible that says God's covenant with Israel has been changed, altered, broken or completed; in fact it says just the opposite. If you need verification of this, please read Genesis 17:7 and 13. They tell you exactly how long God's covenant will last.. it is “an everlasting covenant”. This means that using terms such as “completed” and "fullfilled" with regard to this covenant is an error. God chose Abrahams family for many reasons, not just to deliver Jesus Christ to the world; and He will not be finished with Israel for some time to come. (Rev. 7)

The covenant God made with Abraham is as prevalent today as it was the day God made it. If this was not true, the Jews would not have been returned to the land God promised them as He said they would be. You see, that too was part of the covenant, because it is necessary that Israel be in the land God promised Abraham in order for the Messiah to return. How else could the 3rd Temple be prepared for His return if not for Israel and the covenant God has with his chosen?

Yes we can all receive the salvation God provided through Jesus Christ, but that is a totally different matter and there’s a bit more to receiving that salvation than having faith and trying to live in the example Christ provided. (John 3.3)

BY GOD, I have found another miracle.
But the ones that ellude me are still hidden in the ones I still judge:-)
Gods will is that I find them alll:-)
THE OTHERS have them.
God will show me where they hide them.

Originally Posted by Zou

You made some strong points. Problem I have is which time of exile from the Promised land are you referring to. The Messiah did come to the jews threw the family of David. The jews did return from exile in the land we now call Iraq. In order for that prophecy to be fulfilled.
The Christ fullfilled every prophecy given to the Jews concerning the messiah. I am not saying that the jews are not still Gods choosen favorit. But their are no old testment prophecy's that have not been fulfilled threw the Christ none!!!!! For you moslims out their what prophecy's did the false prophet muhammed fulfill that relate to the Turin prophecies or our old testments. No prophecies matter after the Death and resurrection of Christ. They all be false .

Okay, I don’t want to throw too much at you at one time, but on a forum such as this it’s difficult to cover the topic without getting too wordy. So, I’ll just do my best to try to keep this as short as possible and hope I don’t overwhelm you. Please, if you have questions, do not hesitate to ask though, okay?

The Bible contains hundreds of prophecies, some of which were fulfilled more than 3000 years ago. Others have been fulfilled since then. Others have found fulfillment or partial fulfillment during even in the past 200 years. For instance; Luke 21:29-31, which obviously could not take place until after the time of Christ since He is the One who made the prophecy. Since we have already established that this prophecy had to take place after the time of Christ, the scattering of Israel that is mentioned also had to have taken place after the time of Christ. This eliminates the possibility that it is reference to any previous exile from Israel. And He said "when the fig tree blooms again, people will know that the End Times and Kingdom of God is near" The fig tree is Israel and it began to bloom again in 1948 and obviously, the End Times did not take place after the previous scatterings.

Many say that the lengthy removal from the land God promised Israel and the suffering of their people as in Germany was a result of their rejection of Jesus Christ. I’m not bold enough to make that statement, but will leave that for Israel and God to work out. Another important prophecy that could not have been fulfilled by Christ appears in Matthew 24:14, where we are told that the Gospel (the New Testament books of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) will be preached throughout the world. How could this be fulfilled by the birth, crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ? That would produce quite a paradox, don’t you agree? Then there is the prophecy in Revelation 11:9-10 of the two prophets and how the world would be able to simultaneously witness them. How could this prophecy be fulfilled during the time of Christ? This could not possibly happen until today with the use of television and the internet.

There are others, but I hope this helps, and as I said before, if you have questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

Originally Posted by Lookagain

BY GOD, I have found another miracle.
But the ones that ellude me are still hidden in the ones I still judge:-)
Gods will is that I find them alll:-)
THE OTHERS have them.
God will show me where they hide them.

Okay.. Do I want to ask what you mean by this? Or would it be best if I didn't? *chuckle*

Originally Posted by cranston36

Fact : On September 11, 2001 a group of men who were mostly of Saudi Arabian citizenship flew airplanes into the World Trade Center in New York City and the Pentagon and destroyed one airplane over Pennsylvania.

Looking at George Bush at this time we can see a lot.
I used to wonder why he was doing the things he was doing. It sure was vexing. It never was clear what he up to. Add in Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld and Condoleeza Rice and it just became a mess that just could not be cleaned up.
Then, on August 21, 2006 in the White House he said that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11.
That meant to me that Iraq is not part of the war on terror.

Iraq war and terror are not totally the same. You can have both statements be true.

<snip>
I am pretty sure that we have got a Judas Priest on our hands. Some folks have called him a ‘Witch-King’ but I think that’s going a bit too far.

I have never heard Bush called the "witch-king."

After all - lots of nice folks voted for him. Of course - he seems to have deceived a lot of folks so it all balances out.

How does that balance? Aren't they two different things entirely?

<snip>
When I hear them beating their chests I remember something from Job in the Holy Bible, “Job xli. There is no power on the earth which can be compared with him, who was created that he should fear no one.”
The Bible says that.

What bible? Job does not contain that quote.

Another connection to the one who was created to fear no one spans back in recent American history.
To a man by the name of Billy Sunday. He was an evangelist who lived during the late 19th and early 20th century. He was a driving force behind Prohibition and influenced men like Billy Graham, Jimmy Swaggart, Pat Robertson and other modern evangelists and their preaching styles.

Sunday was an evangilist. He was an opponent to alcohol but I am not sure he was a driving force behind prohibition. And you will have to educate us as to what influence he had on Swaggart, Robertson, etc.

He started as a baseball player and there begins the link to President Bush. President Bush in his early career owned part of a professional baseball team in Texas. The company he was involved with arranged to have land condemned so that a new stadium for the Texas Rangers could be build. He made a pretty penny on the deal while he was still Governor of Texas.


Here is the chronology of Bush's interest in the ball club.
1989 - Bush buys a minority stake in the Texas Rangers.

1994, November: Bush is elected governor with 53.8 percent of the vote.

1994, December: Before taking office, Bush resigns as managing general partner of the Rangers but keeps his ownership stake in the team. At the time, his share is 1.8 percent equity interest, plus another 10 percent bonus if the team is later sold and the investors get back their original investment plus interest.
The city of Arlington, TX built the stadium - not Bush. Just like today, the city is building the Dallas Cowboys a new stadium. It happens everywhere.


That brings new meaning to the phrase ’Play Ball!’.
More like hard ball.

Do you have a point?

<snip>
This brings us to the connection with Mister Peacock and modern evangelism and its association with President Bush.

I was hoping we would get to a point.

The Peacock Angel seems to have power in this modern political world out of proportion to what people in general know about him.
One of the primary reasons if not the main reason given for invading Iraq (not including the lies about the Weapons of Mass Destruction) was to free the Kurds from the oppression of the Muslims.
Why would any God fearing agent like the President of the United States be intent on freeing devil worshippers unless there were some connection between them?

No point yet.

The connection between them, of course, is deeply rooted and flows through the evangelical speeches of men like Billy Graham and Pat Robertson like poison through the vine of life. From their mouths they spew not only hatred for specific persons that oppose them politically but they provide support for the worst among us. They seem to advocate that if you kill, maim and murder that if you merely think about Jesus Christ then you are saved.

That is patently absurd!

<snip>
The evil in the world is being injected into our automobile gas tanks each day and showing up in our paychecks each week and in our taxes each year.

What? I am so lost in this convoluted illogic!

<snip>
Has your own fear paralyzed you so that you will stand aside and let them destroy us without a word in protest? Without a hand against the Peacock Angel?

I have no idea where you learned logic, but I would ask for a refund!

Originally Posted by Zou

That was well written .

It was? Cranston's post was poorly organized, lacked facts or support, based arguments on unfounded assumptions.

If you think it was well written, you are in the majority I am sure.

But to many will not see the trueth of what you are saying .

If Cranstons post made any sense, I am sure we would all see his message.

<snip>

You do not need to choose a faith to be saved. You have to have faith to be saved .

What? That makes no sense!

That Faith is based on trueth . Trueth is not hidden from us .

FYI. The word is spelled truth.

Its there in plain site. Do you think that a man who truely loves God and knows what God demands from us .

Is that a question?

Can be a person who also desires Leadership(power) or Wealth (power) or the desires of the flesh(Lust) or the degrading of the flesh(ALL Drugs). Does a preacher need to ask for donations if he is truely sent from GOD ? I think not. The Christ said Give to Ceasar that Which is Ceasar. This is a referrance to $$$$ only . Not our immortel souls or our bodies which belong to GOD. If a preacher ask for money he announces to the world he is like Ceasar.

A preacher asking for money is not violating what Jesus said in the Gospels. Your logic is appalling.

This sort of illogical mumbo jumbo makes my head hurt!

Originally Posted by Kix

Okay.. Do I want to ask what you mean by this? Or would it be best if I didn't? *chuckle*

read "the last judgement", under the end of the world as we know it.

Spelling correctors will be ignored.

Answer me this question??? If someone comes in your country and hi jacks you plan and rams them in two buildings. And rams another plan into the pentgon. And kills thousand of people. Because they hate your country and and they hate you even if they don't know you. What would you do if you were persident??? I'm not saying George is the best president in the world. But, sometimes you got take a stand even when the world is against you. When 9/11 happend changed our view we are not safe. This is a crazy world and we are inherited and it's scary. But, if we can't not get peace in the middle east. When Lebon and other countires want to make nuclear bombs to destroy us. So what is a president supposed to do. F.D.R took us into World War II when pearl harbor got it. And he was paralyzed from polo. He knew we couldn't sit back and watch was happeing and stay out of it. He knew sooner or latter that we were going to be drawn in it. So did President Woodrow Wilson during World War I. Don't be so hard on Bush try to think what you would do if you were president during these crazy times.

Originally Posted by Kix

Okay, I don’t want to throw too much at you at one time, but on a forum such as this it’s difficult to cover the topic without getting too wordy. So, I’ll just do my best to try to keep this as short as possible and hope I don’t overwhelm you. Please, if you have questions, do not hesitate to ask though, okay?

The Bible contains hundreds of prophecies, some of which were fulfilled more than 3000 years ago. Others have been fulfilled since then. Others have found fulfillment or partial fulfillment during even in the past 200 years. For instance; Luke 21:29-31, which obviously could not take place until after the time of Christ since He is the One who made the prophecy. Since we have already established that this prophecy had to take place after the time of Christ, the scattering of Israel that is mentioned also had to have taken place after the time of Christ. This eliminates the possibility that it is reference to any previous exile from Israel. And He said "when the fig tree blooms again, people will know that the End Times and Kingdom of God is near" The fig tree is Israel and it began to bloom again in 1948 and obviously, the End Times did not take place after the previous scatterings.

Many say that the lengthy removal from the land God promised Israel and the suffering of their people as in Germany was a result of their rejection of Jesus Christ. I’m not bold enough to make that statement, but will leave that for Israel and God to work out. Another important prophecy that could not have been fulfilled by Christ appears in Matthew 24:14, where we are told that the Gospel (the New Testament books of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John) will be preached throughout the world. How could this be fulfilled by the birth, crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ? That would produce quite a paradox, don’t you agree? Then there is the prophecy in Revelation 11:9-10 of the two prophets and how the world would be able to simultaneously witness them. How could this prophecy be fulfilled during the time of Christ? This could not possibly happen until today with the use of television and the internet.

There are others, but I hope this helps, and as I said before, if you have questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

Ya Kix - I goofed there as I know Christ made prophecies that hadn't been fulfilled/ I was mainly talking about prophecies about him. I was also referring to the fact that Christ himself is the Last prophet any after him are false prophets. But as far as the book of revelations . I do not except that as inspired by God . Which really doesn't matter as other prophets pretty much covered it all anyway.

Originally Posted by Zou

Ya Kix - I goofed there as I know Christ made prophecies that hadn't been fulfilled/ I was mainly talking about prophecies about him. I was also referring to the fact that Christ himself is the Last prophet any after him are false prophets. But as far as the book of revelations . I do not except that as inspired by God . Which really doesn't matter as other prophets pretty much covered it all anyway.

What about the two prophets spoke about in Revelation?

Originally Posted by Zou

Ya Kix - I goofed there as I know Christ made prophecies that hadn't been fulfilled/ I was mainly talking about prophecies about him. I was also referring to the fact that Christ himself is the Last prophet any after him are false prophets. But as far as the book of revelations . I do not except that as inspired by God . Which really doesn't matter as other prophets pretty much covered it all anyway.

Why don't you believe the book of Revelation is part of God's word?