The Non Jewish Historical Thread

[Noibn]

Originally Posted by TakuanSoho

Well, I have lived in Japan, and had a lot of conversations with Japanese who fought in the war. I have great respect for the Japanese.

That being said, their government at the time was horrible, and the world is better off we won.

However, the arguments the others are presenting are valid to a great extent. The only problem with it is in the end, the Japanese government sucked. It is sort of like saying that the WWI restitutions caused WWII. To an extent yes, but the Germans still more or less elected Hitler.

Although he readily agrees that the war against Japan had to be fought and it was a good thing we won it, Nicholas von Hoffman, in "Make Believe Presidents", called the Pacific War more a "protracted race riot than a war." Given the propaganda (and other) excesses on each side, he has a point.

[Noibn]

Originally Posted by Bonzo'sCostar

Noibn:

I think most of Wayne's war movies are awful...almost unwatchable.

He played the same character in all of them.

LOL!!

Indeed he did.

His westerns were more varied.

[TakuanSoho]

Originally Posted by Noibn

Although he readily agrees that the war against Japan had to be fought and it was a good thing we won it, Nicholas von Hoffman, in "Make Believe Presidents", called the Pacific War more a "protracted race riot than a war." Given the propaganda (and other) excesses on each side, he has a point.

Haven't read that, and while he has a point, I don't think it was much of one.

That would be like calling the European War a "protracted race riot than a war." Both Japan and German believed that they had social darwinism on their side mandating that they rule, but that was more a justification than a reason for war.

The other nations fought against them for assorted reasons, but race was not really one of them.

[Bonzo'sCostar]

Originally Posted by TakuanSoho

Did we talk about this yesterday? Military or not? And Where?

Don't think so. I talked some with 36shadow about living briefly in Japan to do judo.

[TakuanSoho]

Originally Posted by Bonzo'sCostar

Don't think so. I talked some with 36shadow about living briefly in Japan to do judo.

Okay, that wasn't you then. I think it was Forrest now that my memory is working.

I did the english route. Out in the country (way out). Great time.

[Bonzo'sCostar]

Originally Posted by TakuanSoho

Okay, that wasn't you then. I think it was Forrest now that my memory is working.

I reminded you of Nathan B.? I see no provocation to justify insults.

[TakuanSoho]

Originally Posted by Bonzo'sCostar

I reminded you of Nathan B.? I see no provocation to justify insults.

My apologies, just that both of you had lived in Japan, that was the only comparison I meant.

[Noibn]

Originally Posted by TakuanSoho

Haven't read that, and while he has a point, I don't think it was much of one.

That would be like calling the European War a "protracted race riot than a war." Both Japan and German believed that they had social darwinism on their side mandating that they rule, but that was more a justification than a reason for war.

The other nations fought against them for assorted reasons, but race was not really one of them.

I was including our own propaganda re the racial "traits" of the Japanese in there as well. Our record towards Asians in general from the 1860s onward informed much of that anti-Japanese propaganda. No, our re-lo camps, criminal and disgraceful as they were, pale before the crimes of the Japanese.

[TakuanSoho]

Originally Posted by Noibn

I was including our own propaganda re the racial "traits" of the Japanese in there as well. Our record towards Asians in general from the 1860s onward informed much of that anti-Japanese propaganda. No, our re-lo camps, criminal and disgraceful as they were, pale before the crimes of the Japanese.

Western racism was always there, but in this case I don't think it helped to lead to the war.

Speaking of it though, just received in the mail today "The Chinatown Trunk Mystery" by Mary Ting Yi Lui. From the amazon review it sounds like a fascinating look at some of that racism.

[Bonzo'sCostar]

How 'bout the domestic vs. international theory of causation for the Great Depression? Personally, I see disparity of wealth as an over-looked but very important cause.

Or, conservatives pointing out that WWII and not the New Deal brought us out of the Depression, only serve to show that FDR's big-gov't spending was inadequate in comparison.

Not historical, perhaps, but I do a pretty good justification for progressive taxation.

Was MLK helped by having the Black Panthers as the implied alternative?

I got a million of 'em.