This law sounds like common sense to me, but I'd be willing to bet that the ACLU sees it as a violation of patient confidentialty. Society has been trying for years to remove the stigma of mental health treatment and so placing a person's treatment records into a national database is not going to sit well with many. Those same records could also be accessed by the DMV and anyone who had ever been involuntarily commited could, possibly, be denied a driver's license. I see the common sense in that also. A 5,000 lb. automobile can be just as dangerous in the wrong hands as a gun, but where do we draw the line at violation of privacy? This is a real double edged sword here.

__________________
Most of the world's crises can be tracked back to the fact that WE HAVE TOO MANY LAWYERS.
---------------------------------------------------
Without women, money would have no meaning......Aristotle Onassis.

THE NRA AND LOBBYING....

The facts are that lobbying groups do help shape legislation and aid greatly in this. The car safety standards which were brought to the fore in the late 60s early 70s were greatly shaped by Ralph Nader and groups of consumer advocates. Lobbying can work in a good way if the group is truly interested. MADD is another very good group that has helped shape legislation in a positive way.

First, the NRA is not stupid and realizes the most effective way to combat problems with the 2nd Amendment is to go on the offensive. As you well know the offensive is to NOT give up ground and take more ground when possible. They have always viewed the 2nd Amendment as the 'slippery slope' and the NRA took the high ground very earlier and will NOT compromise. It has been a winning strategy for them, they stick with it.

Now, with that logic the NRA has always argued (with money and lawyers) the 2nd Amendment will stand in its purest form. That means ALL people will get the right to bears arms (all arms) unless there is absolute cause to curb weapon possession with overwhelming evidence of killing of human life due to guns/weapons/lethal force. Look at the problem loophole with gun shows and I have made my point here; gun shows are abundant and the NRA won that battle with having very few restrictions at these shows. They were able to curb back a number of restrictions on the Brady Bill through arguing the case in front of the Supreme Court too; they DO pay lawyers to do this. But, did they ‘pay’ for legal representation or legislation lobbies dealing with guns and mentally ill people?

The voting block...lobbying and congress. It is terribly naive to think the NRA does not utilize their voting block and does aggressively lobby congress as a LOBBY; they are not a bunch of single individuals. They know what solidarity does; they are the most solidified lobbying group we have today IMHO. Look at their site and list after list of ACTION ALERTS…is any one of these to help restrict gun usage by mentally ill people? Find just one for me there.

Lastly, the NRA has fallen eerily silent after the Brady Bill rollback, many states still have many problems with gun control and restricting mentally ill people from purchasing weapons. Again, have they spent actually time and money to help with more severe restrictions with mentally impaired people and weapons? NO. When the Brady Bill was rolled back did they offer to help with any sort of alternative in terms of mentally ill people and gun restrictions? NO, none. Mentally ill people were actual in the group of ‘less gun restrictions.’ The NRA did not blink and eye at this, it made no common sense.

Wayne La Pierre can talk all he wants about their 'position' but no time and money has been spent to keep a Cho away from a gun store or gun show purchase.

So...

• The NRA has plenty of money and time to go after all restrictions to keep the 2nd Amendment in what they think is its purest form.
• The NRA has used little time and money to offer alternatives and legislation which will curb purchase of weapons by mentally ill people. They have been silent (in actual practice) on this.
• The NRA realizes they do not have to offer a damn thing to the other side even if it means a good amount of commonsense in terms of this subject.

30+ have died now because people sat on thier hands about mental health and weapons (let alone other instances of severely mentally ill people aquiring weapons)...case closed.

So do you think it would have been all that hard for him to buy guns on the black market ? I really don't know, thats why I'm asking. Seems everything I'm used to in New Orleans is not so standard elsewhere in the country.

Hell, here in New Orleans, half the guns taken in as evidence were later sold to the highest bidder in one lump sum and ended back out on the street used in crimes all over again in orleans Parish a few years ago.

__________________
"A nation can survive its' fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and he carries his banners openly. But the traitor moves among those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the galleys, heard in the very hall of government itself. "Cicero, 42 B.C., Roman Statesman, orator, and author.

Honestly, I don't know and I really don't care. We are talking about LEGALLY selling a weapon to someone with severe mental problems. This is the most harebrained f***ing idea we have allowed to happen in all the years since the 2nd amendment was ratified. This speaks for itself, there is nothing to defend or compare here. ILLEGALLY acquiring a weapon has zero to do with this, at that point all bets are off. You are mixing up the issue of mental competence with gun safety

Would you sell a weapon to someone knowingly so nuts they would then load bullets up right in front of you and shoot you dead?

Guys I just got to smile. I don't know for a fact, but I do get the impression, that a few of you probably visit thehighroad, glocktalk, thefiringline, or guns.net. The NRA is NOT considered a right wing lobby by shooters. It is considered, by most shooters, as way too LIBERAL. Funny how two people look at the same picture.

__________________
Gun control WORKS! That's why it is so safe to walk the streets of L.A., Chicago, and D.C. at night.

I must not have made myself clear since I think this law is a good, common sense approach to the problem. I just think that it may be struck down as being unconstitutional. Those things don't always go hand in hand with common sense and the case is far from closed. Let's see what the ACLU and the APA and the Supreme Court do about it.

__________________
Most of the world's crises can be tracked back to the fact that WE HAVE TOO MANY LAWYERS.
---------------------------------------------------
Without women, money would have no meaning......Aristotle Onassis.

Cat, a mentally defective (for lack of a better word) person is NOT allowed to purchase a weapon. Form 4473, the yellow form that is required for a purchase of a weapon has 10 or so questions which if answered in the affirmative, will stop the transaction. This form is also the form that background investigation transaction receipts must be recorded on. The fact is that a mentally defective person IS NOT ALLOWED to purchase a weapon. The rules are not the problem. The fact that there is no good way to determine whether an individual is scrambled in the head is the problem. Other things that will cease a weapon purchase, not verbatim, from memory...Illegally in this country, Dishonorable discharge from military service, Convicted felon, Any domestic violence (misdemeanor or felony) renouncing citizenship, Mental defect, Drug use...there are more, but I do not remember.

__________________
64,999,987 firearms owners killed no one yesterday.

The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to rule it.

But how is it that the system(s) has not tracked people with mental problems in numerous states? This transaction was not stopped with Cho...how good is the yellow 4473 form? Actually there is a way to track if someone is scrambled in the head and that comes from mental health professionals but the system has to keep up with that.

I am not sure you have gathered my point here. Whether the NRA sits far right/moderate/left does not matter as much as the money and membership they have. Watch what happens when there is a perceived threat to the 2nd amendment; the membership jumps and people rally. It does not matter whether they think the leadership and message is too soft (you use the word liberal very loosely for them), they will come together very fast when needed. They are not shunned by guns owners and the group has plenty of money and a very large membership. The NRA has not suffered a mass exodus of members because of them being too soft about the 2nd amendment, I will assure you of that.