Another point taken into consideration by our founding fathers....as they determined that the right to worship and to believe is an absolute right....but it does not do away with the right of someone else not to believe.....as clearly stated and ruled upon by strictly adhering to specific wording.....the right to believe is absolute as long as the action of that belief does not infringe upon anothers rights...to believe how they will.....simply put the government remains neutral on the position of religion...it is left up to the people to chose...but not to chose at the expense of someone else and their rights. Nobody wants to be under the control of any theology...in fact the governments in Europe were corrupted by absolute control of theology...that is why this country came into existence in the first place.....and as expected it was addressed and addressed quite clearly and explicable by our founding fathers....as they wished to remain away from any such mistakes. BD

>>>Socialism as practiced in America, is the plundering of the middle class by "capitalists" through the buying and selling of the wholly-owned legislative and judicial processes.

Yes that is why it became quite evident of this as the Supreme Court determined to give away personal property rights to the state for the good of all......oh what a minute...that is a communist platform...is it not....but here we sit....the legal system controlled by the mean old conservatives...giving up this private right to ownership.....as my pappy used to tell me..."SON...IF YOU WERE TO TELL THAT STORY TO A MULE...HE WOULD KICK YOUR BRAINS OUT....FOR BELIEVING HE WAS STUPID ENOUGH TO BELIEVE IT". BD

Quote "The problems with the capitalistic society I see today: The working class, middle America is finding it harder and harder to survive. They do most of the working, building of this country. While corporations rake in the money, and pay their CEO's outrageous amounts every year, the ones doing the work are losing more and more benefits. To top it off, the working class is being taxed so that money can be given in grants, tax rebates , ect to these corporations that pay their CEO's these outrageous sums." Unquote

This is not capitalism but a so called "mixed economy". The philosophical problem with a "mixed economy" is who is doing the mixing and for whom. We have seen incrementalism work on a daily basis until we now find a country that is more controlling than the Crown was when the Founding Fathers pledged their lives, their fortunes and their sacred honor. The left claims they want to return the freedoms envisioned by the founding fathers but they would do so by creating even more roadblocks to economic freedom.

As far as corporations paying "outrageous" salaries to CEO's etc, you act as if the corporation is some individual entity. Its obvious that you either don't understand the nature of a corporation or chose to ignore it. The corporation is owned by its shareholders, those who have invested in the company. The amount of input each shareholder has depends on the amount of investment. Would you require a privately owned business to limit the salaries of its owners? Why would you do with with a publicly owned entity. If the CEO is overpaid it will either fail or the board will be removed at a shareholders meeting in the future. Why do you not complain about the income of a sports figure or an entertainer?

To me, the economic system is either completely free from government intrusion or its just a matter of "The Politics of Pull" and no man is truly free

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Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy

Why don't you give us your defination of the term. That should be a real hoot

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Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy

They do not seem to understand the concept....the more legislation that comes forth.....the more limiting it is on the people.....the more you legislate the more you dictate. It has always been so..it will always be so....that is what makes the programs run by the government so wasteful...as they spend most of their time trying to figure out just what is legal to CYA....by the time a decision is made it often times comes at the cost of time....and time is money in the business world. BD

I'm sorry Nathan, my vision was a bit narrow. My bitch is that we have no problem taxing the middle class for such things as "economic developement", when these same corporations that we are giving tax incentives and grants to, are cutting back on their benefits to the very ones they are getting the tax incentives from.

Small businesses do not realise the same benefits as larger corporations, and yet, for the majority, most of the income stays within the community.

Now we could compare corporate welfare vs. citizen welfare. That would be an interesting debate.

As to entertainers and sports figures, I think that their incomes are ridiculous. I don't watch or go to sporting events, so I don't support them. I also don't watch much tv, or go to the movies, so I also don't support them. What was your point?

If "they" is implying me, you are wrong. I am not talking legislation. I am saying that I would rather see my tax dollars spent on college eductions than on giving some company that pays it's CEO'S millions., tax abatements.

Freedom
I don't think we should tax anyone and give that money to anyone else for any reason. I think corporate welfare is just as evil if not more so than public welfare. At least a case can be made for public welfare in which we are helping the least among us. Of course you can also say that corporate welfare is nothing more than taxes being returned to businesses.

I think anytime the government gets involved beyond its mandate to protect us from foreign invasion and create a system in which contracts can be enforced "We the People" lose.

We are not as far apart in what we expect as you may think, my entire argument is that true capitalism is the only economic system that is entirely consistant with freedom. Anything else is nothing more than varying degrees of slavery

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Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy

They are any that espouses...communism by socializing the government system...in pretense of offering social programs to the public.....FDR knew the difference....Harry Truman and JFK....also knew that offering social help did not have to include hindering the capitalistic system that created the means of allowing social help to begin with. As there is an old saying that still holds true today.....YOU CAN'T HELP THE WORKER BY IN FACT BRINGING THE DOWN THE SOURCE OF THE PAY...IE....THE EMPLOYER....WHICH IN MANY CASES ARE IN THE FORM OF CORPORATIONS. BD