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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 12-23-2007, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by CrankyYankee View Post
"Economic systems overlay on top of social and political systems."


Which sort of eliminates simplistic feel good answers, because the relationships themselves are complex...

But simple feel good answers are what most people are looking for....

A friend once told me that "The easiest way is usually the best way."

I'm pretty sure that isn't true...
The free market system is basically a Western based conncept of supply and demand. It would truly work if:
  • There were no political boundries
  • All people had the same eduation and knowledge base
  • All people believed in the same exact God, or all were atheist
  • All people lived in the same climate
    etc
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Old 12-23-2007, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat's meow View Post
The free market system is basically a Western based conncept of supply and demand. It would truly work if:
  • There were no political boundries
  • All people had the same eduation and knowledge base
  • All people believed in the same exact God, or all were atheist
  • All people lived in the same climate
    etc
Where do you come up with nonsense like this?

Why is it necessary for you to use strawmen, equivication and false dilemmas to make any point?

Can you engage in rational discourse, at all?

Din't think so.

Tokie
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Old 12-23-2007, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by cat's meow View Post
Actually none of that was said...but...

Gee, hey, look at me, I know Economics and you don't, whoopee!!! You're an idiot!!!

Economic systems overlay on top of social and political systems. You are not very intelligent in picking up on this are you?
I know very little about economics.

But that's a university-library more than you know.

You believe that government is the best thing for directing economic systems....just like the wildly successful Soviet Union.

'Nuff said.

Tokie
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 12-23-2007, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Tokenconservative View Post
I know very little about economics.

But that's a university-library more than you know.

You believe that government is the best thing for directing economic systems....just like the wildly successful Soviet Union.

'Nuff said.

Tokie
Actually you do not really know what I think or know (or anyone else for that matter) because you are way too busy talking and not listening.

Before you get into your next 'pinko, commie, socialist' rant, you might want to know there is no such thing as a purely communist/socialist system and those who have tried to make this happen end up failing (imagine that, I think that very thing and you never picked up on it, as I said, you are a poor proofreader). Also, there is no pure free market system. Countries base their strength on the give and take of centralized power, how you are able to distribute power and/or freedom among the masses is what success or failure rides on...both socialism and a free market system tend to de-centralize power in their purest forms. This centralizing or decentralizing can be done in a number of different ways through economic and social initiatives. But, the soviergnty of a country and people are based on this too. These all interact with one another in a number of different dynamics, a balance has to be acheived.

That is only a small part of what I personally think but I know this is far too complicated for you to figure out...probably wasting my breath here.

Last edited by cat's meow; 12-23-2007 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 12-23-2007, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by cat's meow View Post
Actually you do not really know what I think or know (or anyone else for that matter) because you are way too busy talking and not listening.

Before you get into your next 'pinko, commie, socialist' rant, you might want to know there is no such thing as a purely communist/socialist system and those who have tried to make this happen end up failing (imagine that, I think that very thing and you never picked up on it, as I said, you are a poor proofreader). Also, there is no pure free market system. Countries base their strength on the give and take of centralized power, how you are able to distribute power and/or freedom among the masses is what success or failure rides on...both socialism and a free market system tend to de-centralize power in their purest forms. This centralizing or decentralizing can be done in a number of different ways through economic and social initiatives. But, the soviergnty of a country and people are based on this too. These all interact with one another in a number of different dynamics, a balance has to be acheived.

That is only a small part of what I personally think but I know this is far too complicated for you to figure out...probably wasting my breath here.
LOL.

And there it is: "I am UNIQUE!!! JUST LIKE EVER' OTHER SHEEP WHAT THINKS JUST LIKE ME!!!"

Okay, Kitty Litter...if it will help you sleep better, you are the most unique member of your herd.

Now, I do know exactly how you think. You can believe that what you believe is fresh and new and that nobody has every thunk it 'afore, if you want. Go right ahead. But I've been listening to the mindless, Pollyainish maunderings of "anarchists" for decades

Din't make any sense the first time I heard about it in junior high back in the 70s, and makes even less sense now. At least early anarchists did not lard their nonsensical "theories" up with all sorts of stupidity about "systems" and how some sort of hivemind would negate the need of laws and whatnot.

So blather on about it all you want--blah, blah, frekin' blah-- I've heard everything you have to say, a hunert times in the past and no doubt will a thousand more before they lay me to rest somewhere.

Anyone who can actually say that socialism is all about "decentralizing" power has got absolutely no understanding of socialism, and sounds like a moron saying that. But this too is what I expect: anarchists, I've learned will spew just about any nonsense they can to justify their utterly inane views.

But tell me, just for drill: what is it in a "system" of anarchy that will prevent Joe Strongman from taking what he wants from Lester Weakman?

Tokie
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 12-24-2007, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Tokenconservative View Post
LOL.

And there it is: "I am UNIQUE!!! JUST LIKE EVER' OTHER SHEEP WHAT THINKS JUST LIKE ME!!!"

Okay, Kitty Litter...if it will help you sleep better, you are the most unique member of your herd.

Now, I do know exactly how you think. You can believe that what you believe is fresh and new and that nobody has every thunk it 'afore, if you want. Go right ahead. But I've been listening to the mindless, Pollyainish maunderings of "anarchists" for decades

Din't make any sense the first time I heard about it in junior high back in the 70s, and makes even less sense now. At least early anarchists did not lard their nonsensical "theories" up with all sorts of stupidity about "systems" and how some sort of hivemind would negate the need of laws and whatnot.

So blather on about it all you want--blah, blah, frekin' blah-- I've heard everything you have to say, a hunert times in the past and no doubt will a thousand more before they lay me to rest somewhere.

Anyone who can actually say that socialism is all about "decentralizing" power has got absolutely no understanding of socialism, and sounds like a moron saying that. But this too is what I expect: anarchists, I've learned will spew just about any nonsense they can to justify their utterly inane views.

But tell me, just for drill: what is it in a "system" of anarchy that will prevent Joe Strongman from taking what he wants from Lester Weakman?

Tokie
You again have completely twisted what I said, I won't expalin, no need...you don't 'have it all upstairs' to understand the conversation.
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Old 12-25-2007, 01:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat's meow View Post
You again have completely twisted what I said, I won't expalin, no need...you don't 'have it all upstairs' to understand the conversation.
Cat this sentence sums up Tokenthekooliaid quite well,

Actually you do not really know what I think or know (or anyone else for that matter) because you are way too busy talking and not listening.

The man is just verbally masturbating, talking at people & not the least bit interested in...... what did they call it in the old days....? AH yes, conversation.
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Old 12-25-2007, 01:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat's meow View Post
Actually none of that was said...but...

Gee, hey, look at me, I know Economics and you don't, whoopee!!! You're an idiot!!!

Economic systems overlay on top of social and political systems. You are not very intelligent in picking up on this are you?
Ok that was funny.

I first read the Tokenthekoolaid diatribe, THEN read your post & THAT just cracked me up!
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Old 12-25-2007, 02:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Tokenconservative View Post
On the other hand, I suppose it's entirely possible that you've floated this for some sort of verification.

In the event that that's what you are on about, let me verify for you that yes, indeed, this is utter economic nonsense that has been completely repudiated over the decades since Malthus was with us, and yes indeed as well, your belief in it does show that you while you can key the word "economics" you lack even the most simple-minded understanding of the term as is show by anyone in modern times who'd attempt to wind the clock back to the mid 19th century with this Natural Law view.

In short, yes, I can verify for you in spades: you are an idiot.

Tokie
Personally I don't know nor do I care about Malarius or what ever some guy who sat on his ass tryin' to pontificate about the money game.

I definitely do not think some forced reorganization of money from the wealthy to the poor is ANY kind of answer.

Nor have I ever. So go stand in front of a mirror & talk at yourself some more. It's about as relevant as what you post here.

Um a simple real world example of thinking from the smallest to the largest in organic terms comes from the man who invented & used the Micro loans technique in India. All the tokenthekoolaid-like pundits in the established banking industries at the time were saying there's no way you can do this...You loan some poor peasant woman $100.00 bucks they'll just take it & never come back. Well guess what? Some did. Tokies all, see I told ya only multi national ENRON loans are the kind we should EVER do! Well,
hold on there skippy.
Turns out the vast majority of those peasant commie low life scum women actually DID pay the Loans back & empowered themselves to start their own business & became successful entrepreneurs. & this nutty wack job guy got a Nobel Peace prize for doing it. How's your cracker Jack prize on the mantle doing there professor?

Working from the bottom up as a Conscious form of economics can & does work & has nothing to do with your binary 2 dimensional ignorance.

Oh & on the subject of life forms making decisions. They've been doing it for billions of years. Many times organic systems are quite intelligent in their choices. One can't necessarily see them because they move on time scales VASTLY longer than one human lifetime or one bowel movement for you.

Tokie needs to stop token the koolaid.
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Old 12-25-2007, 02:33 AM
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Why not would a free market economy work regardless of the ethnic or religious make up of the Country?


People like Soda.

People make Soda, people pay people to make soda.

Same with cars, Books, Computers and countless other shit we make and sell every day that runs the economy.

Why not also should Companys be free to sell those same goods overseas?

It would greatly improve our economy if barriers to Free Trade like the WTO (or Nambla), NAFTA (or Nambla) where removed and the idea of profits and productivity where not demonized and assaulted....


Or NAMBLA.
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