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Old 05-06-2008, 11:57 AM
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You know I look around my area and I do not see soup lines. I do not see long lines at the unemployment office. I do not see a call for massive assitance to those out of work. I dont see factories in my area closing down.

In fact there is still an office and manufacturing building boom going on in my area. All be it mostly electronic and defense there is still a lot of building going on which means high tech jobs which are high paying jobs.

Yes fuel cost are up. Yes food prices are up. Yet we don't have inflation. It seems that America is coming out of a false economy where just about everything was way under priced compared to most of the world.

Now we could go back to such prices if we got the government out of our energy policy. Let us drill for our own oil. Stop this stupid ethanol program and grow corn and other food stuffs for people and live stock.

Then maybe Icey would not worry so much about his wealth.

I do believe if you earn $75k per year or more you are in the top 10% of income earners in our nation. And by todays standards, $75K is not rich unless you are a Liberal trying to raise taxes.
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Old 05-06-2008, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by reccles44 View Post
You know I look around my area and I do not see soup lines. I do not see long lines at the unemployment office. I do not see a call for massive assitance to those out of work. I dont see factories in my area closing down.

In fact there is still an office and manufacturing building boom going on in my area. All be it mostly electronic and defense there is still a lot of building going on which means high tech jobs which are high paying jobs.

Yes fuel cost are up. Yes food prices are up. Yet we don't have inflation. It seems that America is coming out of a false economy where just about everything was way under priced compared to most of the world.

Now we could go back to such prices if we got the government out of our energy policy. Let us drill for our own oil. Stop this stupid ethanol program and grow corn and other food stuffs for people and live stock.

Then maybe Icey would not worry so much about his wealth.

I do believe if you earn $75k per year or more you are in the top 10% of income earners in our nation. And by todays standards, $75K is not rich unless you are a Liberal trying to raise taxes.
No, no soup-lines yet. Factory closings were done 10 years ago when Sarbanes-Oxley was enacted by congress in the wake of ENRON. Our manufacturing base already moved off shore.

In the info-age, we see the precursers to the collapse very early, such a Bear-Sterns collapsing, a company with assets worth 3 Trillion sold for 280 Billion. That should be like a pistol shot next to your ear.

If you've ever cut down a large tree, you know that you eat away at the trunk for a long time, then-ever so slowly at first, the tree begins to topple then it gains speed the closer to the ground it gets. Well, we are in that almost impreceptible period just prior to the fall gaining speed, the FED lowering rates is akin to our tree hanging up against another tree for a moment, but the damage has been done, the tree will fall. All it takes is the slightest breeze.
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Old 05-06-2008, 12:32 PM
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Icy,

The environment is more important than the economy.
America needs to shut down more factories and use fewer resources.
Americans need to stop importing products from Europe.
Europeans are using up the earth's resources to produce these imports.
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Old 05-06-2008, 12:38 PM
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Icy,

The environment is more important than the economy.
America needs to shut down more factories and use fewer resources.
Americans need to stop importing products from Europe.
Europeans are using up the earth's resources to produce these imports.
While these statements have validity, what about China? The recent National Geographic (yes, Federal Propaganda with great pictures) portrays a spooky situation at hand. And they are often exempt when the rest of the industrialised world is expected to bow out willingly.

Just throwing it out, as I don't currently have a concrete stance.

America does need to go back to an Agricultural nation if it is to survive in my opinion though. Where the power lies in the cities and townships, not Washington or the UN with their Sustainable Development tactics that will destroy not create.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 05-06-2008, 12:38 PM
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Icy,

The environment is more important than the economy.
America needs to shut down more factories and use fewer resources.
Americans need to stop importing products from Europe.
Europeans are using up the earth's resources to produce these imports.
Buddy, you've been indoctrinated, saturated with bullshit. That's why the Dept of Edu is filled with jew elites, to dumb down America. The environment should be maintained, true enough, we should all be good shepards, but the earth has always and will continue to heal itself.

Factories and all other enterprise is interrelated, we all feed off the whole. To destroy industry is to cut our own throat. Imports are a part of our economy, but the trade imbalance is hurting us.
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 05-06-2008, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by sour_claw View Post
While these statements have validity, what about China? The recent National Geographic (yes, Federal Propaganda with great pictures) portrays a spooky situation at hand. And they are often exempt when the rest of the industrialised world is expected to bow out willingly.

Just throwing it out, as I don't currently have a concrete stance.

America does need to go back to an Agricultural nation if it is to survive in my opinion though. Where the power lies in the cities and townships, not Washington or the UN with their Sustainable Development tactics that will destroy not create.
Americans get most of their exports from Canada and Europe.
Americans do not need go bankrupt funding a healthcare system that can not prevent death.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 05-06-2008, 12:58 PM
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Default Trade Deficits

If Americans collectively import more goods and services from foreigners than we export, we are said to have a trade deficit. Paying for the things we import accounts for most of the flow of dollars out of the United States. However, money flows out of the country for other reasons as well. The U.S. government provides foreign aid and supports overseas military bases; immigrants to the United States send dollars back to their families; foreigners who own U.S. businesses or financial assets take income out of the country.

When these factors are added to the trade deficit, the net outflow of dollars is called the current account deficit. In 2002, the U.S. trade deficit amounted to $418 billion, and the current account deficit totaled $480 billion. Data for 2003 is not yet available, but preliminary reports indicate the current account deficit will be at least $550 billion.

Once the dollars leave the country, three things can happen.

First, foreigners can use dollars to purchase U.S. assets: stocks, bonds, bank deposits, government debt, real estate, businesses. When Toyota buys land and equipment for a factory in the United States, when a British investment fund buys stock in a U.S. corporation, when a German bank purchases U.S. Treasury bonds, then the United States is said to be "financing" its current account deficit by selling assets. In 2002, foreigners acquired $612 billion in U.S. assets.

The United States has run persistent and increasing current account deficits since the 1980s, and foreigners have used the dollars to stake significant claims on U.S. assets. At the end of 2002, the value of U.S. assets owned by foreigners exceeded the value of foreign assets owned by U.S. residents by $2.4 trillion. This is the reason the United States is often said to be a debtor nation, with a net debt to the rest of the world of $2.4 trillion. But this "debt" is denominated in our own currency. For that reason, it does not pose the same risks for the United States as developing countries with large debts—which must be repaid in dollars or euro—face.

Foreign central banks provide a second outlet for dollars that leave the United States. The dollar is the most widely used international currency, and many less-developed countries have sizable dollar-denominated debts. Governments sometimes hang on to whatever dollars fall into their hands, parking them in liquid assets like U.S. bank accounts or U.S. government bonds to earn interest. In 2002, foreign governments held almost $95 billion in dollar reserves, which they will use to cover future deficits, repay debts, intervene in financial markets, or simply to exert influence in negotiations with the United States.

If you've followed the arithmetic so far, you will have figured out that in 2002, on balance, more dollars flowed back into the United States to purchase assets then flowed out. This allowed U.S. companies to buy assets overseas, almost $200 billion worth.

As long as the country's large current account deficit is financed by these capital inflows, it is not necessarily a problem. But a third possible consequence of the massive U.S. current account deficit is that foreigners will lose confidence in the U.S. economy and stop purchasing U.S. assets. If this happens, the supply of dollars in the global banking system will exceed demand and the exchange value of the dollar will fall.

Some people believe this is already happening. Over the past few years, the dollar lost about one-third of its value relative to the euro. This could signify that foreigners are shifting from U.S. to euro-based assets. If the era of dollar supremacy is indeed coming to a close, the value of the dollar will continue to fall. What this would mean for the U.S. and world economies is difficult to predict. A sustained loss of confidence in the dollar could have many potentially serious ramifications.

Imports would grow more expensive, infuriating our trading partners, who depend on the U.S. market for their goods. With less foreign demand for U.S. assets, stock prices might tumble and interest rates rise. United States-based banks and corporations would find it harder to buy foreign assets and expand overseas. The dollar has been in trouble before and, in the past, the U.S. government pressured other countries to buy or hold dollars and prop up its value. Whether other countries agree to this will depend, ultimately, on whether the United States and other major economic powers are still talking to one another.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 05-06-2008, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by April15 View Post
The real question to most
Americans is how secure is my job?
Not to me, I'm a Democrat.

I don't work, I let the suckers work to take care of me while I collect my SSI check. The old lady gets AFDC for her brood. We do okay.

Sure, I panhandle - and me and my brother Med make a few bucks from the dean when we beat up, er I mean counsel kids at the University who break the political correctness codes; but that's not really work.

I'm a proud Democrat, never worked a day in my life!
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 05-06-2008, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IcyPeaceMaker View Post
If Americans collectively import more goods and services from foreigners than we export, we are said to have a trade deficit. Paying for the things we import accounts for most of the flow of dollars out of the United States. However, money flows out of the country for other reasons as well. The U.S. government provides foreign aid and supports overseas military bases; immigrants to the United States send dollars back to their families; foreigners who own U.S. businesses or financial assets take income out of the country.

When these factors are added to the trade deficit, the net outflow of dollars is called the current account deficit. In 2002, the U.S. trade deficit amounted to $418 billion, and the current account deficit totaled $480 billion. Data for 2003 is not yet available, but preliminary reports indicate the current account deficit will be at least $550 billion.

Once the dollars leave the country, three things can happen.

First, foreigners can use dollars to purchase U.S. assets: stocks, bonds, bank deposits, government debt, real estate, businesses. When Toyota buys land and equipment for a factory in the United States, when a British investment fund buys stock in a U.S. corporation, when a German bank purchases U.S. Treasury bonds, then the United States is said to be "financing" its current account deficit by selling assets. In 2002, foreigners acquired $612 billion in U.S. assets.

The United States has run persistent and increasing current account deficits since the 1980s, and foreigners have used the dollars to stake significant claims on U.S. assets. At the end of 2002, the value of U.S. assets owned by foreigners exceeded the value of foreign assets owned by U.S. residents by $2.4 trillion. This is the reason the United States is often said to be a debtor nation, with a net debt to the rest of the world of $2.4 trillion. But this "debt" is denominated in our own currency. For that reason, it does not pose the same risks for the United States as developing countries with large debts—which must be repaid in dollars or euro—face.

Foreign central banks provide a second outlet for dollars that leave the United States. The dollar is the most widely used international currency, and many less-developed countries have sizable dollar-denominated debts. Governments sometimes hang on to whatever dollars fall into their hands, parking them in liquid assets like U.S. bank accounts or U.S. government bonds to earn interest. In 2002, foreign governments held almost $95 billion in dollar reserves, which they will use to cover future deficits, repay debts, intervene in financial markets, or simply to exert influence in negotiations with the United States.

If you've followed the arithmetic so far, you will have figured out that in 2002, on balance, more dollars flowed back into the United States to purchase assets then flowed out. This allowed U.S. companies to buy assets overseas, almost $200 billion worth.

As long as the country's large current account deficit is financed by these capital inflows, it is not necessarily a problem. But a third possible consequence of the massive U.S. current account deficit is that foreigners will lose confidence in the U.S. economy and stop purchasing U.S. assets. If this happens, the supply of dollars in the global banking system will exceed demand and the exchange value of the dollar will fall.

Some people believe this is already happening. Over the past few years, the dollar lost about one-third of its value relative to the euro. This could signify that foreigners are shifting from U.S. to euro-based assets. If the era of dollar supremacy is indeed coming to a close, the value of the dollar will continue to fall. What this would mean for the U.S. and world economies is difficult to predict. A sustained loss of confidence in the dollar could have many potentially serious ramifications.

Imports would grow more expensive, infuriating our trading partners, who depend on the U.S. market for their goods. With less foreign demand for U.S. assets, stock prices might tumble and interest rates rise. United States-based banks and corporations would find it harder to buy foreign assets and expand overseas. The dollar has been in trouble before and, in the past, the U.S. government pressured other countries to buy or hold dollars and prop up its value. Whether other countries agree to this will depend, ultimately, on whether the United States and other major economic powers are still talking to one another.
Americans need to stop all of this importation welfare going to Europe and Canada.
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