I agree. It's a game. I play games for enjoyment. That's about it.
I'm glad you've been in the computer field for four decades. It's a rather broad field to say the least. Are you going to tell me the for example I.T. work is the same as say 3D animation?

There are a quite a vast array of things one can do in this broad field. I would for example never say because i can build 3D worlds I have this great grasp of C++ programming...There is NOTHING comparable.

Come on. I'm sorry but you are displaying a kind of arrogant disdain for something that's about simple entertainment. I mean am I gonna' go fly an F-16 after playing an aircraft fighter game? Of course they are not the same.

Look I listened to the guy. I'm sorry it's bloviating bullshit. I have & know a lot of gamers who play World Of War Craft & similar games & the things he's talking about are not even close to the matrix of interaction going on. The guy is talking about for example Second Life. Sorry but to gamers that's not a game, it's a joke.

He is speaking completely as an outsider.
Play the games to understand why it's engrossing.

It's funny most of the people I know who are deep gamers are also amazingly really connected to real life. They see it for what it is, just a game.

Yes He is READING WAAAAAAYYYY To much into this.

It's clear he is an outsider, period.

__________________
The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw.
- Jack Handy

I would not expect you to understand Eve's market or it's level of interaction. However, it's economy is driven by a lot of things you do not realize.

Building Ship and Ship components, requires two things. Materials and a Blueprint. The only source of minerals of any decent supply is asteroid belts. You need to mine asteroid belts to get the minerals to build the ships and compenents, along with ammunition, drones, weapons and so on. So, if you run a large alliance. You need miners to mine, builders to build and fighters to fight.

All of which starts with miners who supply the builders with minerals. Who build the ships for the fighters.

See, I can't even explain it decently.


Despite it's lack of environmental interactions, regarding certain things like labor costs, and such. Those things are being implemented gradually. Ship crews, etc. Interactive planets that you need to terraform and settle.

So, in short.

Play the game. You can play it for free for 14 days. Browse the market and come back to me and tell me it is not indicative of interactive digital capitalism.

Also, why would you read this much into a fucking computer game? Learn to let things go, and discuss things like computer games with a pleasant tone and happy disposition. This is not after all, about PETA.

__________________
"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman

Ilove and the wife hates my online gaming. I try to pass it off as a way to communicate with my brothers but that only lasted for so long.

I've been loving the call of duty series for a while now and absolutely enjoy their new installment (COD4).

Right now I'm in Elder Scrolls Oblivion and love those types of games (Fable and the like). An online game of such magnitude as EVE might just make me a passing figure in my babies's lives. Don't bring this shit up Crow.

__________________
He who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man.
Dr. Samuel Johnson

Heh, I remember trying to direct a large fleet in battle over Ventrillo while holding my 6 month old daughter. They could here my daughter doing her baby mumbling over the headset.

Or the time I was doing recon in an enemy Solar System. Dropped a can of pepsi over my Keyboard, stood up really quick. I proceeded to drop my cigarette on my computer chair, burning a hole in and singing my carpet...

Multi-Tasking while playing this game is no easy task.


I do advise you check it out. You can try it out for 14 days free, though.

__________________
"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman

DOn't get me wrong, the boys have seen me kill a plenty but it seems to be a proximity thing with me and the wife. I behave as much as I can but still have some marathons during a wkd once in a while. 360 is my platform BTW.

__________________
He who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man.
Dr. Samuel Johnson

Your not a real gamer, if you use a console.


Real men use a keyboard and mouse.

__________________
"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman

EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Consoles are for pansies!!!!

Your multi tasking story was cracking me up.

__________________
The crows seemed to be calling his name, thought Caw.
- Jack Handy

There is a game that puts people into bad situations, although it is not an online game. It is called SIMSOC and it is played in some advanced sociology classes in college.

By the way Mr. Bitter, it is a fucking game.

Ummm . . . . . . yeah. I think he hates his life.

Nah, it has NOTHING to do with politics. When you think everything has to do with politics you have a screw loose . . . . . maybe more than one. Maybe you are pissed because you got laid off or something, don't know, but take it easy - it is just a game.

Sounds like Spaceward Ho! but amped up, which was like Empire before that -- each going back a decade and a decade before.

But what you are claiming is that everyone who claims that these games offer any learning or provide any social benefit beyond pure entertainment is talking crap, right?

I spent too much time on such games in the 80s so I learned not to get involved with them.

And then I had a chance to use forum software like this with with a community of ten thousand people where we engaged in in depth discussions on just about everything. Not only more interesting, but also legitimately work related and also educational.

It is ironic, but I found larger communities where very detailed and in depth discussions could be had back in the 1980s inside DEC than I can find on the whole of the internet today.

Any way, I've heard/seen/read multiple discussions about how these virtual world are the next big thing or are going to transform the world, then heard an economist discussing this topic in an capitalism free market economics promoting podcast, then I saw the post here with more some what similar outrageous claims.

When it comes to economic theory and advocated practice by conservatives, what I find is that they live mostly in a virtual world like a lot of games. There are no real problems, no pollution, no disabled, no poverty, just challenges that any good game player can over come, and if they can't, well they are losers, so they should just learn to play the game better. As if, "game over, want to play again" works in real life.

I actually have more than a few friends I met in Game from my time in Eve. Most of whome are from New Zealand, Europe, Canada, Anglophone Asia (spelling). Who I have met in person. It is rather interesting how easily friendships can come to you playing Eve.

One such friend from New Zealand I met in Iceland at fanfest.

In the end it is about entertainment. I think I just got bored with the game for a while. I am actually, not in a hurry to get back. It happens when you play it for a long time. Perhaps I will never reactivate my account, but I do keep in touch with a lot of the people I meet in the Game. I even meet one for drinks at the bar over in St Louis a couple months ago to catch up.

But yeah, I am well aware of the limits they had on Computer Games in the 1980s. Unless of course you had access to University rigs, or 20 grand to kill.

I think the underlying principle of EVE Online is that you can not experience the game without stepping outside the Sandbox. Losing your wallet in 5 minutes time, and failing over and over till you get it right.

I think it speaks a lot about it's playerbase as opposed to other Games. Eve Players are probably the most Unique bunch of the whole community of Online Gamers. Vets like myself, stuck through some tough shit to get where we were. My Character was even featured in a brief article in PC Gamer.

Sounds trivial, but It makes me smile remembering some of the accomplishments and failures I had in the game.

__________________
"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman