My thought/question for the more economically informed posters concerns the proposed "tax rebate" plan.
I like being able to keep my money as well as the next guy. But if there is going to be a "rebate", I would like to see it go to where it will do the most good.
I'm aware of the contribution of the national debt, the war, all the other things. The common theme of the current crisis seems to be the effect of the housing/foreclosure situation and how it effects the banking system over-all.
We personally know several young families living in apartments because they can't afford the initial cost of buying a home. The incidentals...closing costs, appliances, etc. I would bet many posters know families in similar situations.
Whatever amount of "rebates" are decided, would this money be better spent on direct help to families such as these to actually purchase a home?
I don't pretend to have the specifics worked out, I was just wondering about the effect overall if it was somehow possible.

While this sounds like a nice altruistic gesture my question is why can't these young people save enough money to buy a house? There are so many programs today for first time buyers it boogles the mind that there are those who can't seem to enter the housing market. One of the reasons IMHO is that young people today don't want to start at a reasonable level. They want better than their parents have now. There are 100's of lower priced houses on the market but instead today's young people want the $200,000 plus house in the upscale neighborhood. My neice who's husband is a music minister and she works for the post office just bought a $275.000.00 house. A month later her hours were cut at the post office (she was only hired as a temp anyway) and now they can't afford the mortgage. If they had purchased something they could actually afford with some cushion they would have no problem.

When I bought my first house in 1971 only my income was counted and my house payment could not be more than one weeks pay. Was this the house I wanted for the rest of my life? No, but it was a house I could afford and maintain and 4 years later I sold it and moved up and then moved up again. Now, at the age of 63 I have a nice little (2000 sq ft) log cabin in the East TN mountains on 5.5 acres of land.

My kids (four of them) are mixed. Three have bought homes, one has not. big screen TV's, fast cars, and exotic vacations seem to be more important to them. How many of today's young people living in apartments pining for a home of thier own really are willing to save for the privledge?

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Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy

Median home prices in this area are about $240,000 now. The families I'm talking about aren't the ones driving the new BMW down to Circuit City to pick up the latest 72" flat screen, HDTV. They aren't looking for a palace to live in.
With all due respect, its not the 70's anymore. We did the same thing...bought our first house for 33k. Sold it 6 years later and moved to the house we wanted.
Really nothing altruistic about it. If the housing crisis is causing so much trouble, it affects us all. My own personal feeling is that some will get the rebate, spend it on crap, be broke again in a month. Others, such as me, will put the money away. Won't spend it. Hows that gonna help?
Direct financial help to get qualified families into homes they otherwise couldn't get into would do more to help the situation than cash payments to those that will do nothing with it. IMO
I can hear it now...well, they can move to a cheaper area...yes they could, but moving involves expenses also. So moving might eat into their savings and they would still be without a home.
Its not meant to be a cure-all. It was just something I was wondering about.

Well, renting really is the way to go till you can save enough to buy a home. If you think you can make enough playing the real estate game go ahead, but don't whine when the bank bites you in the ass.

I currently rent, and have no plan to buy till I'm around 35-40, by that time my investments and savings should be enough to buy property and build a house.

but if Inflation stays constant, I might have to push my plans to own real property till I'm around 45-50.

Although, if my wife ain't full of shit. My Swiss Gold and Silver Certificates should pay off in 10 years. Then I can speed up that process and perhaps even retire before I'm 50.

I and my wife own stock in, I think Anglo Platinum or something similar. (she does the stock market stuff) I am a bit uninformed on the stock market and really do not like the risk of investing in something with no intrinsic value.

Anyways, $20,0000 of my Grandfather's inheritance from 6 years ago is around $75,000 now. So, I am banking on my wife's apparent savvy in Stocks and my determined nature when it comes to Gold. Which Gold, Silver and Platinum always being solid investments.

I forgot where I was going with this. But, even if you rent all your life. As long as you can get decent medical care, and afford to live, why look down on people in apartments. Owning a house is a liability when you factor in taxation, upkeep, and so on. If you intend to sell it, sure, but if you want to live there than it's a whole other story.

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"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman

Median in the Tampa area a quarter mill? Move to Jacksonville or the Panhandle. I know for a fact the Jacksonville area is cheaper. What I find is that when housing prices are through the roof wages are equally high unless you live in a retirement area where those folks from up north were able to sell their shacks for outrageous prices and thendrive the cost of housing up. I will admit there are areas where housing is not affordable to those just starting out but the answer to that is move to where it is.

Be that as it may I think we also need to question the entire home ownership issue. Having been both a home owner and a renter I find advantages and disadvantages in both. One of the factors is that we are told that rents will always go up and we could be priced out of affording living. Well the same is true for home ownership. The "sleepy" little village of Fernandina Beach Florida is a case in point. 30 years ago Fernandina was rural and housing was inexpensive. People bought houses for around $15,000.00 and taxes were low. Now because its on the ocean and its been discovered by cash flush retirees houses are in the million dollar mark and property tax has risen dramatically, to the point that many old line residents are losing their homes because they can't pay the tax. Since these follks are considered lower class and rubes the Democrats moving in (and that is true folks, most of the new residents are from New York and New Jersey and are primarily liberal Democrats) want to see the old liners moved out. Who wants a concrete block house with a horse in the front yard next door to thier million dollar beach front property? Palm Beach Florida simply had the houses condemned and moved the residents out so high rise condo's could be built and the tax base increased. Again, all for the benefit for the Eastern Liberals moving into Palm Beach County. These areas will be off limits for the middle class because of this.

As Satv said there is nothing wrong with renting, its standard procedure in many countries. After all isn't the goal here to become more like the French?

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Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy

Another reason we need to reconsider the idea of Property Taxes.

It seems to be just a subtler way of taking people's property.

__________________
"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman

I don't have a problem with property taxes per se. I do think there may be a way of putting a cap on increases as long as the original owner is living in them. I have some property in Putnam County Florida. Its unimproved and the taxes are still low but they have been reassessed several times and now they are being taxed at 4 times the rate they were just five years ago. At some point I will have to either sell the property (which right now the market will not pay what its assessed at) or lose it for the taxes. Putnam County, halfway between Jacksonville and Orlando wants to cash in on the Yankee migration as well and they will eventually price people like me out of the county.

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Its better to have fussed and crabbed then never to have fussed at all - Lucy

This Gov't Deserves No Taxes

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I guess we can disagree on that. I personally feel if you own something, you should not have to pay Government rent on the property.

Although, others would word it differently, that is how I feel on the matter.

__________________
"It is the Right of the People to alter or abolish the Government"
Declaration of Independence
"Never trouble another for what you can do for yourself."
Thomas Jefferson
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there'd be a shortage of sand."
Milton Friedman

See this is the kind of stuff I hear that pisses me off, I would be ok with property tax per se but I believe that once you reach a certain age they should go away then once the owner passes away they can reinstate a tax on the property to a new owner. Property tax on the elderly is criminal in my eyes and is just a way to drive those from their homes to assisted living or old age homes. I am still a long way from that but I hope we in this country will value our elderly and treat them with the respect they deserve. One last thing in reality property tax means you just rent you never own they give you the illusion of ownership.

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Live your life so that when you die.
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