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03-30-2008, 04:00 PM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Merrimack, NH
Posts: 2,515
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Will Hillary or Obama have right to imprison you?
According to John McCain, citing Supreme Court rulings from the US Supreme Court in cases against the Bush administration, a president Obama or President Hillary Clinton will have the unitary authority to deem any American citizen a threat and order them imprisoned without any access to US Courts.
Do you believe that the US Supreme Court was correct in its ruling, and is John McCain correct in his interpretation of the US Supreme Court decisions?
If President Obama or President Clinton orders you to be swept up, sent to a secret location, and then tortured, as President Bush argues is the right of the US president, will you confess to being a terrorist, or will you claim that you are being held contrary to your rights?
If you are being held contrary to your rights, which rights are you claiming?
Certainly you would not claim the US Constitution gives you rights, unless you believe the conservative, strict constructionist, non-judicial activist, justices are wrong, and the liberal justices are correct.
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03-30-2008, 05:16 PM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: SW Oklahoma
Posts: 13,606
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Can you provide a link to this statement by McCain?
__________________
An informed voter scares the Goverment lackeys.
An American first and always a Conservative.
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03-30-2008, 08:08 PM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Merrimack, NH
Posts: 2,515
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob
Can you provide a link to this statement by McCain?
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It is mentioned in this episode; it doesn't have him actually saying it, but someone who asked questions of all three of the current candidates, McCain, Clinton, Obama.
This American Life
The podcast won't be available for a week, and the website doesn't provide much detail on who was featured, and I was shopping for food when the statement was made so I wasn't focused on taking notes.
Quote:
353: The Audacity of Government
We've noticed a trend in a number of actions taken lately by the United States government. Tiny things, things you probably haven't heard of, but with big implications. Harassing widows. Defying a century-old and utterly benign treaty—with Canada! So we've decided to spend an hour admitting and talking about the fact that everyone knows is true: America's become a jerk.
And yes, the always-illuminating Jack Hitt will do some of this talking.
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In any case, you should not be surprised that Bush has claimed he can do this and that the
US Supreme Court has said that he can, and it makes sense that McCain would say that the US Supreme Court has said that he would be able to hold any US citizen without the courts having any say. If he didn't say that, he would be attacked by the conservatives for being weak and anti-American.
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03-31-2008, 05:46 PM
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Political Junkie
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Ohio
Posts: 173
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More important than a link to McCain's alleged statement, could you cite the supreme court decision affirming this power?
Quote:
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Certainly you would not claim the US Constitution gives you rights, unless you believe the conservative, strict constructionist, non-judicial activist, justices are wrong, and the liberal justices are correct.
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The Constitution does not "give" you any rights, it merely affirms pre-existing rights and protects them.
Quote:
"You have rights antecedent to all earthly governments; rights that cannot be repealed or restrained by human laws; right derived from the Great Legislator of the Universe."
-- John Adams
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Quote:
"The whole of the Bill (of Rights) is a declaration of the right of the people at large or considered as individuals .... It establishes some rights of the individual as unalienable and which consequently, no majority has a right to deprive them of."
-- Albert Gallatin, New York Historical Society, October 7, 1789
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04-02-2008, 01:12 AM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Merrimack, NH
Posts: 2,515
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellowjacket
More important than a link to McCain's alleged statement, could you cite the supreme court decision affirming this power?
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I don't recall what McCain cited, but how about
Hamdi v. Rumsfeld
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04-02-2008, 07:48 AM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TEXAS
Posts: 4,559
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mulp,
If President Obama or President Clinton orders you to be swept up, sent to a secret location, and then tortured, as President Bush argues is the right of the US president, will you confess to being a terrorist, or will you claim that you are being held contrary to your rights?
I would think if Obama or Clinton were President and had a Republican Congress that was trying to prevent the FBI/CIA from gathering intelligence to prevent a terror attack, their supporters would want them to have these powers.
This is what you get when you gamble with the lives of innocent Americans for political gain. 
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04-02-2008, 09:18 AM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 12,508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mulp
It is mentioned in this episode; it doesn't have him actually saying it, but someone who asked questions of all three of the current candidates, McCain, Clinton, Obama.
This American Life
The podcast won't be available for a week, and the website doesn't provide much detail on who was featured, and I was shopping for food when the statement was made so I wasn't focused on taking notes.
In any case, you should not be surprised that Bush has claimed he can do this and that the
US Supreme Court has said that he can, and it makes sense that McCain would say that the US Supreme Court has said that he would be able to hold any US citizen without the courts having any say. If he didn't say that, he would be attacked by the conservatives for being weak and anti-American.
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Why are you making accusations and then not offereing anything at all to support them?
Which Supreme Court cases said this? Because the one below doesn't say this at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mulp
I don't recall what McCain cited, but how about
Hamdi v. Rumsfeld
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The US government lost this case, so again, what case was it that McCain cited?
Lets see here, you can't come up with anything that says McCain actually said this and you can't come up with any Supreme Court case which says this either. Why should anyone believe you?
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04-02-2008, 09:27 AM
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Seasoned Veteran
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: In liberal's nightmares
Posts: 62
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mulp is full of it.
McCain never said it, the US SC court never ruled it.
Typical liberal misinformation trying to demonize their opponents with lies.
__________________
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds - Einstein
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04-02-2008, 12:20 PM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,842
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Probably they will, but only if we don't swear allegiance to the party...like in Ohio.
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04-02-2008, 12:36 PM
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Machiavelli Incarnate
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: West Virginia ( Gods Country)
Posts: 4,435
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Certainly any president now has the right to imprison anybody with out charges . Bush saw to that.
All they have to do is say you are suspected of terrorism.
And who defines terrorism? the president of course.
You could be guilty of terrorism economically because you advocate more regulation on business . which Bush deems as a terrorist act against the economy.
Presidents that follow Bush will have the same powers.
__________________
Real Christians Don't Support Preemptive War
Life is not about counting the number of breaths you take , life is about the moments that take your breath away.
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