This isn't about abortions, but I didn't know where else to put it- I apoligize if anyone could think of a better section that I did.

there are many anti-choice people on here who I personally don't agree with. there was also a thread on euthinasia. these things and a TV show I watched got me thinking about a difficult senario:

you have just had conjoined twins. although they were born with relatively no complications their health begins to decline. the doctors give them a pet scan and find that one of the twins is missing organs and is sharing bits of their siblings. the sibling with all of their organs is working double time to keep them both alive.
their condition worsens. The doctor's conclude that if they stay together they will not live very long. if they seperate the one with the organs will live, but the other one will either die on the table or soon after surgery.

what do you do?
let nature take its course and loose both of them
or
sacrifice one child for the other?

I'd never want to be in the position to make this decision.

I think you have to be realistic and save the child that has the organs. Hasn't this actually happened before? I don't think it is possible to save both in this situation so better to honor their legacy through one remaining living person vs. zero.

I kind of equate this to organ donation. I'm an organ donor. Why the heck would I take all my organs with me when it could save someone else's life? The only thing that might be useless is my liver.............

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I'm here for the beer and the ball bustin' band.

They will not give you any logical answers wolf.
While I am against abortion and wish another never had to be performed , I am pro choice. because you cannot legislate morality.
These pro life people are generally real hypocrites.

Birth control pills women take every day cause abortions too. Most of these idiots don't even know that and will stand on anti abortion lines while being on the pill themselves. How hypocritical is that?

Fertility clinics flush fertilized eggs down drains as biowaste .

Yet all you ever hear these hypocrites holler about is abortions .

Then they complain because their taxes are used to feed the kid after its born.

I have come to the conclusion that people either have sense of they don't you can't knock it into them.

Perhaps though you and I wolf could work on a law outlawing hypocrites having anymore children. That would help future generations at least.

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American Politics and More the forum for smart people.

http://americanpoliticsandmore.com/forum/index.php

agreed.

I have no issue with people who dislike abortion. but they should not try to run other's lives and should be consistant.
most of these people don't even adopt.

I have no respect for extremists however. there are groups that say if we have an embryo that tests positive for a condition that will result in a child dying a slow and painful death, we shouldn't destroy it. how can anyone want to bring suffering like that on someone?
I've watched people die with great pain before. I've also watched nurses administer strong doses of pain killers in hopes of both easing their suffering and possibly overdosing them. and I do not blame them for that.
(now when I was six and selfish I was angry about that because I couldn't understand that it was worth my grandfather dying if it meant he wasn't in pain. even when I was 13 and my premature cousin's were taken off their ventalators I was mad, but at the time I was holding out the hope that they would live.)

yes cases like the one I presented have happened before. on the show I watch (it was a dramatization) the mother wouldn't choose and the father didn't want to either at first. the doctor's got a court order and began the surgery. they got an injection, but when they got to the operating room the doctor made them look at them. told them they didn't want to loose both. the father told his wife that the first baby, Angel, has no insides. then the mom asked what they'd tell the other one, Hope. He said "We'll tell her that her sister died to save her."
I cry everytime I watch it (I could actually do it now to be honest)

no one wants to be in these situations, but they happen.
rather its a sick child, grandparent, parent, sibling, cousin, or spouse.
and believe me no matter what you choose it is horrible. but personally, ending their pain is the best option.

Death is not the ultimate evil, but is too often viewed that way...

Life is the ultimate gift...but if it is a life of unending pain?

But what pain is worse? Emotional or physical? I think emotional.

Either way, there is immense emotional pain to deal with.....

Thus your tears Wolf. Empathy is powerful, and one of the best facets of human nature...

WVP, you're so quick to answer for everyone & still bashing people in the good ole Christian way I see???

I don’t see how this has anything to do with being pro-life or pro-choice & if you want a religious answers to these types of questions, you’re not going to get any.

Wolf...
If this happens to a religious person that is truly close w/ God, it’s likely they will pray in hopes to gain guidance or even the answer. It is not for any other to assume.

For all others, the medical proof of will happen may be enough. So they save the baby that can be saved, & yes let the other know there was a greater sacrifice. I can’t imagine this happening to me & wouldn’t have a logical answer as to what is right or wrong at this point.

But a good question…..

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTQfERb9HVk For my sis.....

The circumstance you describe is about the only time conjoined twins are separated when there is certainty that one will die.

The twin that shares an organ, or organs, with its sibling has the right to defend its life, or have someone else defend it's life if the other twin is threatening it. Your life can be threatened by someone else in the absence of intent on their part and you do have the right to defend yourself.

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"It's not alive, It's not alive, It's not alive. Because I said it isnt', there's your proof jerk." ...lexi

"As far as your logical fallicy shit - shove it. I am a woman."...naturemomma

Hypocrite. That is an interesting word to use in the context of your statement. Tell me, are you in favor of erasing laws on the books that make rape illegal? How about all forms of killing (murder, manslaughter, etc.). Do you want to see laws that make stealing illegal? How about child molesting? Would you be in favor of erasing the laws that make child molesting illegal? Unless you say yes in every instance; unless you favor erasing all the laws that I have mentioned and thousands of others and allow all members of our society to do as they please whenever they please, you admit to being a hypocrite yourself because laws making murder and rape, and theft, and child molesting, etc illegal do in fact legislate morality. All laws that forbid a person from doing a thing are attempts to legislate morality.

Since I am quite sure that you don't mind having laws on the books that forbid your neighbor from killing you because you let your dog take a dump on his yard, I am confident that you really don't mind legislating morality so long is is your morality that is being legislated which makes you a far worse sort of hypocrite.

And I would favor restricting birth control pills that have an abortificient effect. And I would favor allowing fertility clinics to only fertilize and place one egg at a time. It would make the proceedure more expensive than it already is, but if you can not afford the treatment, adoption becomes a much more attractive alternative.

Funny. Coming from a hypocrite who stands and points at others and calls them hypocrites.

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"It's not alive, It's not alive, It's not alive. Because I said it isnt', there's your proof jerk." ...lexi

"As far as your logical fallicy shit - shove it. I am a woman."...naturemomma

[quote=PaleRider;306393]Hypocrite. That is an interesting word to use in the context of your statement. Tell me, are you in favor of erasing laws on the books that make rape illegal? How about all forms of killing (murder, manslaughter, etc.). Do you want to see laws that make stealing illegal? How about child molesting? Would you be in favor of erasing the laws that make child molesting illegal? Unless you say yes in every instance; unless you favor erasing all the laws that I have mentioned and thousands of others and allow all members of our society to do as they please whenever they please, you admit to being a hypocrite yourself because laws making murder and rape, and theft, and child molesting, etc illegal do in fact legislate morality. All laws that forbid a person from doing a thing are attempts to legislate morality.
QUOTE]

rape, murder, and chld molesting do have moral connotations, but have a legal basis.
a person is protected not just from forcible death by another but from harm. to rape someone is to violate them and harm them. child molesting is illegal because children can't consent. only consenual sex is legal.

a fetus isn't alive. and yes some birthcontrol can cause abortions-which is why you don't take it if you are pregnant. same thing for some heart medications. don't you notice all the labels that say 'do not take if pregnant or may become pregnant'? its not someone's place to ban those if people don't read the labels.
but thats not what we are talking about in this thread anyway.
lets get back on topic please.

So, this is an abrotion thread?.!

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTQfERb9HVk For my sis.....