Quote:
Originally Posted by cat's meow
I am going to come back to abortion and keep it there, I think it is important to the argument and the thread. It is my fault for going the other way for second but I was illustrating a point.
Steve, these are the very brutal realities of human nature and society:
We are designed to pro-create and we WILL HAVE SEX regardless of themost stance views about religion, sex, chastity. Everything that is a biological entity on the planet is designed to pro-create. And, not in a million years is anyone with some 'pie in the sky' view of morals and values going convince me that every child born has a high % chance or becoming the next nobel prize winner let alone a person who is not depedent (somehow) on society in some way, shape, or form to exist.
So you don't want gov funded abortion for an unwanted new person to be put into society?
Now, many more of your tax $s will be used to later aid that person all the way from adoption services by the state to special educational services in public schools, to drug rehab services---to paying more for a criminal justice and penal system when that future person becomes a lawbreaker. Remember these are your tax payers dollars and you, as a conservative, don't want to pay all this money out for these things.
Brutal? Nope, look at %s Steve, the numbers are with me on this. And, we can talk about 'morals and values' too---religious compassion, but in the end it is better to give an abortion rather than go for an unwanted pregnancy and the domino effect 'on your tax payer $.' This is an unwanted human being that nobody gives a sh*t about enough to raise properly from the beginning. Conservatives want people to be self-reliant? This person in no way will be able to be self-reliant because they are not going to be put into a 'training cycle' of self reliant or productive.
In far more primative societies a retarded or deformed baby was left out the wild to die. Yep, brutal. Before you take that step how about the society offering the abortion?
Sorry, but this is where I see myself as being a moderate and go with the brutal reality of what our taxes do pay for. I will go for the much chealer abortion rather than a real drain on the whole system later.
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The bottom line in all of this is that unless the mother's life is in danger we are still talking about rewarding irresponsible behavior. I have no issues with adoption agencies and have no issue with giving tax $$ to those facilities to give the unwanted kids you speak of a happy home. I have more than 1 friend who had to go outside the country to adopt because there was either too much red tape here in the states or other factors in them not being able to adopt "lcoally". Maybe we should look at some of the laws and ask ourselves why we have to go outside the country to adopt when there are so many kids here who need homes. My issue isn't abortion and I understand your reasons although I did not once hear you mention the father. Is he willing to care for a child he helped create? Does he have a say in this at all? Should he? I believe he should.
Regarding sex, I agree with you. I lost my virginity at an early age and while I was irresponsible in most everything in my life as a teenager, the one thing that did stick with me was the realization that I didn't want to be a father. I had a friend who did become a father at 16 at that wasn't a very good thing for him, obviously. While I certainly wouldn't have been labeled a stud (the '80's were the peak of 'mullettdom' and I had mine!), I suppose I did okay but always had a condom with me if I thought I had a chance to "score". Most times, I scored with myself but that's another story
Sex obviously affects different people ways and people react differently towards it - especially their first time. Luckily, I was good with it and those first few girls I was with seemed to be good with it. I never had anyone freak out on me (let alone a parent coming after me) but I had seen/heard about it with others. That could get scary sometimes.